New Build

[klimpaparazzi]

hello everybody
need some help with hardware help
but first
I am saying bya-bye to my notebook (that is dead now for couple of weeks, btw tryed to revive it - doesnt worth it)

so im getting my self a new desktop ( didnt had its kind for a long time...)

most of the use for the computer will be graphic design, games (such as BF2), and probably in the near future some 3D (like CAD and/or same category software)

i have a budget (with out teh monitor) around 500-600

this is what i was thinking:

now to the Q - i have problem with 3 maybe 4 components: mb, cpu, video card and maybe ram (although thats not the main concern for me).

now for the cpu i was thinking
All the intel fans - i was thinking on intel but its kinda expansive for me. so if someone have better suggestions they are most welcome.
AMD Phenom II X4 965 Black Edition Deneb 3.4GHz (I read a lot saying i can overclock it up to 4.0Ghz with the right cpu cooling. About the cooling i was actually thinking on the Corsair H50

now about the MB I'm a bit not sure. I did some reading and i figure these mb:
MSI 790FX-GD70 AM3 AMD 790FX ATX
ASUS M4A88TD-V EVO/USB3 AM3 AMD 880G HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX
ASUS M4N98TD EVO AM3 NVIDIA nForce 980a SLI ATX
ASUS M4A89TD PRO/USB3 AM3 AMD 890FX SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX
ASRock 890GX Extreme3 AM3 AMD 890GX HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX

basiclly i did the search my self (as i mentioned above i didnt build any comps for a while).

i will need between 6-8GB (seen some great deals on NewEgg and SlickDeals)

another component is the video card - as i mentioned i will be playing BC2 and do some graphics (though for the graphic software i will need more memory)

Thanks in advance for the members who will help me.

if you have other build you think will be great - i will gladly appriciate any suggestions.

 

[reflex99]

Here, Ill throw something together for $600

motherboard:
ASrock 870 Extreme 3 good board, would have liked to go with a 890 chipset, but then i would have had to cheap out somewhere else
CPU:
Phenom X4 955 Overclocks better than 965, saves some $ for other components
RAM:
G.Skill ECO Known to work well with AMD boards

video card:
Gigabyte GTX 460 pretty much the king of budget video cards. although you might want to wait a week when ATi will be releasing their new cards, which should bring price drops on GTX 460s

HDD:
Samsung F3 best price/performance drive

Case:
Rosewill Blackbone nothing too fancy, if you don't like it then substitute it for something else

PSU:
Earthwatts 380D more than enough power for this system. 80+ bronze rated

$607 after rebates


EDIT:

if you want to get the price down, you can get this processor instead:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...706&cm_re=athlon_ii_x4-_-19-103-706-_-Product

 

[PewPewBangBang]

ATI is announcing/launching their new 6 series cards next week........will be shipping out by the end of this year.

Reflex's build isn't bad

 

[Tsunade]

^ by the way no WAY you run power a 460 and a 125 watt quad core with a 380 watt psu...are you kidding me?

The best value are the AMD Phenom II tri core processors:

AMD Phenom II X3 740
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103699

I love Gigabyte, best motherboard manufacturer hands down.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128438

Best value 890 board without all the excess stuff

4 GB DDR3 1600 Corsair

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145260

Visiontek 5850 1 GB (last reference cooler/PCB 5850 on the market)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814129141

Cooler Master Hyper 212+ best aircooler for under 30 bucks

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103065

After MIR it's like 600.

Build minus OS and ODD for around 600 and less with MIR

 

[Ph?bus]

^ by the way no WAY you run power a 460 and a 125 watt quad core with a 380 watt psu...are you kidding me?

The best value are the AMD Phenom II tri core processors:

AMD Phenom II X3 740
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103699

I love Gigabyte, best motherboard manufacturer hands down.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128438

Best value 890 board without all the excess stuff

4 GB DDR3 1600 Corsair

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145260

Visiontek 5850 1 GB (last reference cooler/PCB 5850 on the market)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814129141

Cooler Master Hyper 212+ best aircooler for under 30 bucks

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103065

After MIR it's like 600.

Build minus OS and ODD for around 600 and less with MIR

Don't take this the wrong way, but going with a DDR2 build right now would just be stupid. DDR2 is starting to phase out, so it's increasing in price. So for about the same price as a DDR3 build, you can have pretty much the same performance, and be future ready.

@OP, you can post in my thread with the format in there, and I'll make a good build for you tomorrow.

 

[Tsunade]

Don't take this the wrong way, but going with a DDR2 build right now would just be stupid. DDR2 is starting to phase out, so it's increasing in price. So for about the same price as a DDR3 build, you can have pretty much the same performance, and be future ready.

@OP, you can post in my thread with the format in there, and I'll make a good build for you tomorrow.

But a cheap build would be perfectly fine with DDR2 right now. Sure if he wants headroom for later on but you can't have it all; performance, low cost, and expandability. One of three have to give.

 

[Ph?bus]

But a cheap build would be perfectly fine with DDR2 right now. Sure if he wants headroom for later on but you can't have it all; performance, low cost, and expandability. One of three have to give.

DDR2 is only cheap if you get 2GB, which is only suitable for grandma's rig, or a netbook.
And even DDR3 is the same price if you get 2GB, so getting DDR2 is just all around wasteful.

 

[Tsunade]

DDR2 is only cheap if you get 2GB, which is only suitable for grandma's rig, or a netbook.
And even DDR3 is the same price if you get 2GB, so getting DDR2 is just all around wasteful.

But again, the average user will not see the benefits between DDR2 and DDR3. And 4 GB of DDR2 and 4 GB of DDR3 RAM is the same thing for the average user. And anyways AM3R might be coming out soon, so might as well not buy AM3.

 

[Ph?bus]

But again, the average user will not see the benefits between DDR2 and DDR3. And 4 GB of DDR2 and 4 GB of DDR3 RAM is the same thing for the average user. And anyways AM3R might be coming out soon, so might as well not buy AM3.

They may perform the same, but they don't cost the same. That 4GB of DDR2 you picked out was $100. You can get 4GB of DDR3 for as low as $65 (IIRC), but the average is $80. So if they want to upgrade before 2015, then they can reuse old memory.
Also, AM3+ motherboards support AM3 CPUs, but AM3+ CPUs won't work on AM3 boards.

 

[reflex99]

^ by the way no WAY you run power a 460 and a 125 watt quad core with a 380 watt psu...are you kidding me?

what?

that rig will draw about 300w MAX no where over. (realisitically it draws ~250 gaming)

125(CPU at ABSOLUTE max load)+
150(GPU at max load, ie furmark)+
25ish for fans+drives
=
300

That simulates a worst case scenario, it is unlikely that he will ever draw that much.


And yes, ddr2 is stupid. Go ddr3 it is cheaper, faster, and good ddr2 motherboards are getting harder and harder to find

 

[Snipeye]

what?

that rig will draw about 300w MAX no where over. (realisitically it draws ~250 gaming)

125(CPU at ABSOLUTE max load)+
150(GPU at max load, ie furmark)+
25ish for fans+drives
=
300

That simulates a worst case scenario, it is unlikely that he will ever draw that much.


And yes, ddr2 is stupid. Go ddr3 it is cheaper, faster, and good ddr2 motherboards are getting harder and harder to find

Don't know where you're getting your numbers from. But just a quick reference: http://educations.newegg.com/tool/psucalc/index.html

AMD Phenom X4, 2x2GB DDR3 (btw, the kind you picked is crap and out of stock), selected a regular desktop motherboard, nVidia Geforce 460, DVD-RW drive, and 1 7200 RPM HDD gives a total of 557W, minimum.

And that doesn't include fans, additional hard drives or DVD/CD drives, or 3rd party heatsinks. Additionally, you will ALWAYS want to get more power for a PSU than less, else you're not only wasting your money, but also running the risk of shorting out the system and losing everything. With that said, why shouldn't you pay for a bigger PSU when you can find a relatively cheap, and reliable, PSU for just a little extra?

 

[reflex99]

Don't know where you're getting your numbers from. But just a quick reference: http://educations.newegg.com/tool/psucalc/index.html

AMD Phenom X4, 2x2GB DDR3 (btw, the kind you picked is crap and out of stock), selected a regular desktop motherboard, nVidia Geforce 460, DVD-RW drive, and 1 7200 RPM HDD gives a total of 557W, minimum.

And that doesn't include fans, additional hard drives or DVD/CD drives, or 3rd party heatsinks. Additionally, you will ALWAYS want to get more power for a PSU than less, else you're not only wasting your money, but also running the risk of shorting out the system and losing everything. With that said, why shouldn't you pay for a bigger PSU when you can find a relatively cheap, and reliable, PSU for just a little extra?

I would not believe a word that calculator says.


Newegg is trying to sell PSUs. They will overrate so they can sell you more.

I am looking at TDPs, and calcualting my self.

dvd drive is not needed, you can install windows off usb. (go down to library put windows on flash drive using their DVD drive)

Aftermarket cooling would be nice, but not practical on this budget.

I would have to spend $30 to get a decent AM heatsink, which would have to take money away from the GPU, which would knock it into the 5770 range, which i really wouldn't want to do.


EDIT: how is g.skill eco crap? Do some research man. Eco's are some of the best memory you can get for the AM3 platform.


I really am trying to be nice here since you are a DL, but please do some more research before you give out misinformation

 

[Snipeye]

Alright, I'll take back my crap comment on the ECOs, but still it remains; it's unavailable and out of stock without any ETA on replacements, if at all. Not sure how that'll affect the budgeted amount, but it'll need to be adjusted.

Second, I'm not trying to give out misinformation. 380watt's is really, really low, and to be honest, unless you plan on using that build without any regards to upgrading in the future, it will become a hindrance and will limit any possibility of expanding. You can say whatever you want about making a PC to an exact specification, but trying to build in some extra head room, such as more watts from a PSU, is always a preference.

Second, yes, you can install windows via USB, but seriously? You're going to cut out a DVD drive that's just $20 or less? Granted, the budget is small, but at some point in time, you're going to put in a DVD drive.

Edit: And don't do me any special favors because I'm a DL.

 

[reflex99]

Alright, I'll take back my crap comment on the ECOs, but still it remains; it's unavailable and out of stock without any ETA on replacements, if at all. Not sure how that'll affect the budgeted amount, but it'll need to be adjusted.

Second, I'm not trying to give out misinformation. 380watt's is really, really low, and to be honest, unless you plan on using that build without any regards to upgrading in the future, it will become a hindrance and will limit any possibility of expanding. You can say whatever you want about making a PC to an exact specification, but trying to build in some extra head room, such as more watts from a PSU, is always a preference.

Second, yes, you can install windows via USB, but seriously? You're going to cut out a DVD drive that's just $20 or less? Granted, the budget is small, but at some point in time, you're going to put in a DVD drive.

Edit: And don't do me any special favors because I'm a DL.

Yea, ok they are out of stock ,now, but they were in stock when i 1st did the build. (jsut like the F3 went up 15$ overnight newegg -->:chair

there is 80w to expand. so if you want a new GPU, that gives you about 230w to work with.

I think there is ample room for growth

 

[Ph?bus]

Yea, ok they are out of stock ,now, but they were in stock when i 1st did the build. (jsut like the F3 went up 15$ overnight newegg -->:chair

there is 80w to expand. so if you want a new GPU, that gives you about 230w to work with.

I think there is ample room for growth

Seriously. People over estimate how much power they need. 400W is more than enough for pretty much most single GPU builds. Unless you're doing extreme overclocks. I mean, an i7 965 @ 3.7GHz + GTX 275 only pulls 396W at full load. So getting a 'small' powersupply isn't unwise if you don't plan on overclocking or multi-GPU.

 

[reflex99]

To add to your point, I think that a GTX 460 provides more value than going with a larger PSU+say a GTS 450

 

[Tsunade]

Sure the draw maybe 300 watt, but you know power supplies are not 100% efficient. Bronze means less than 85% efficiency but higher than 80. So do the math: 380 x .84 (best case scenario) = 319 watt real wattage. So utilizing 300/319 is NOT good. That means during extreme load your PSU will be outputting near maximum of what it can deliver. Not faulting Antec as a bad company but running a PSU near max load will shorten the life of the capacitors inside, and eventually cause multiple component failures later down the road.

My Core i7 rig draws 462 watts at maximum load, but I have a 1000 watt power supply, I don't even run anywhere near 60% (assuming 80% efficiency of my 1000 watt psu would put it at 800 watts).

Of course if you are on a budget, but that doesn't mean you cheap out on a power supply. You generally don't get APFC with 50 dollar and under PSUs, no modular cabling, non nylon sleeved power connections, it's horrible buying a cheapo power supply.

And yet again, DDR2 memory is fine for a CHEAPO build. The average joe will not see the benefits of DDR3, and besides the market for CPU/Motherboards is changing so fast, in 3-4 years you might as well buy a new socket. Many of the current AM2+ AMD boards do not support the Thubian 6 core processors so what makes you think they will support AM3+/AM3R. And even if you buy an AM3 board, you won't get the full bandwidth of the newest processors (they'll probably be on HT 4.0) so again reiterating the point of buying a whole new platform when it comes out.

 

[Ph?bus]

Sure the draw maybe 300 watt, but you know power supplies are not 100% efficient. Bronze means less than 85% efficiency but higher than 80. So do the math: 380 x .84 (best case scenario) = 319 watt real wattage. So utilizing 300/319 is NOT good. That means during extreme load your PSU will be outputting near maximum of what it can deliver. Not faulting Antec as a bad company but running a PSU near max load will shorten the life of the capacitors inside, and eventually cause multiple component failures later down the road.

My Core i7 rig draws 462 watts at maximum load, but I have a 1000 watt power supply, I don't even run anywhere near 60% (assuming 80% efficiency of my 1000 watt psu would put it at 800 watts).

Of course if you are on a budget, but that doesn't mean you cheap out on a power supply. You generally don't get APFC with 50 dollar and under PSUs, no modular cabling, non nylon sleeved power connections, it's horrible buying a cheapo power supply.

And yet again, DDR2 memory is fine for a CHEAPO build. The average joe will not see the benefits of DDR3, and besides the market for CPU/Motherboards is changing so fast, in 3-4 years you might as well buy a new socket. Many of the current AM2+ AMD boards do not support the Thubian 6 core processors so what makes you think they will support AM3+/AM3R. And even if you buy an AM3 board, you won't get the full bandwidth of the newest processors (they'll probably be on HT 4.0) so again reiterating the point of buying a whole new platform when it comes out.

I don't think that's how efficiency works.
And that's peak load. A typical load would be closer to 250W.

Also, please stop arguing about a DDR2 platform. It's more expensive than a DDR3 platform, end of story.

 

[reflex99]

Sure the draw maybe 300 watt, but you know power supplies are not 100% efficient. Bronze means less than 85% efficiency but higher than 80. So do the math: 380 x .84 (best case scenario) = 319 watt real wattage. So utilizing 300/319 is NOT good. That means during extreme load your PSU will be outputting near maximum of what it can deliver. Not faulting Antec as a bad company but running a PSU near max load will shorten the life of the capacitors inside, and eventually cause multiple component failures later down the road.

My Core i7 rig draws 462 watts at maximum load, but I have a 1000 watt power supply, I don't even run anywhere near 60% (assuming 80% efficiency of my 1000 watt psu would put it at 800 watts).

Of course if you are on a budget, but that doesn't mean you cheap out on a power supply. You generally don't get APFC with 50 dollar and under PSUs, no modular cabling, non nylon sleeved power connections, it's horrible buying a cheapo power supply.

And yet again, DDR2 memory is fine for a CHEAPO build. The average joe will not see the benefits of DDR3, and besides the market for CPU/Motherboards is changing so fast, in 3-4 years you might as well buy a new socket. Many of the current AM2+ AMD boards do not support the Thubian 6 core processors so what makes you think they will support AM3+/AM3R. And even if you buy an AM3 board, you won't get the full bandwidth of the newest processors (they'll probably be on HT 4.0) so again reiterating the point of buying a whole new platform when it comes out.

you dont understand do you....

to put out 1000w at 80% effeciency, you would need to draw 1200 from the wall.

380w is the DC output of the PSU. to output 380w it has to draw 450w of AC from the wall.

Go do some research before bashing me kthx?

why do you need a 1000w psu to power 450w rig?


And ATM DDR3 is CHEAPER than ddr2. So what sense does it make to buy something that is outdated and more expensive

 

[-Fake]

Its a nice build but it is also kind of out of date I think but I don't know I don't really keep up with this kind of stuff anymore. I just know what I want when I get the money to actually build my new PC.