A (civil) debate: Updates Vs. Vanilla

[Dreadmaker]

Hey folks.


So, It's apparent looking through division discussions of many different types that we all have very different opinions when it comes to the merits of updates and new weapons.


Some of us feel that updates change the shape of gameplay in a positive way, and add to the challenge presented therein.


Some of us feel that updates detract significantly from the game; that new weapons unbalance classes, change their usage, and change the game in ways that are wholly negative.




What I'd like to do is make a debate for that right here. What do you feel? Why do you think that? Here's your chance to weigh in on the issue. I'd ideally like to keep it centered on the idea of updates in general, not on specific updates (I know a lot of people have big opinions on polycount).




PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE keep this civil. Let's not turn it into an ugly flame war. Everyone has opinions; let's respect them, and make this interesting, not a pain.

 

[xosniper]

To many "I WIN" guns now. I vote Vanilla.



Edit: I still enjoy the freshness of new things, but balance them first.

 

[Believer]

Leave the updates alone - and make one of the servers Vanilla.

 

[Muscles89]

Although I do not like how bloated TF2 has become I'm somewhat in the middle. If Valve would've just stuck with the original concept of getting achievements and then being rewarded with a new weapon, it would've been fine.

Now with hats and weapons and God knows what else falling from the sky and the introduction of the trading system and where you can actually waste real money to "buy" in game weapons, I think has cheapened the game to be almost a circus side show, compared to other online games.

 

[Planeswalker]

I think the change is necessary. Makes TF2 interesting instead of just the same old, same old. I mean, it came out three years ago and it still has a huge following. They've managed to keep the game fresh in a bunch of different ways, they've never asked for a dime, and I'm grateful for it. I wouldn't have 670 hours logged in this damn game if I didn't feel it was worth it .

 

[PepperRabbit]

I think the change is necessary. Makes TF2 interesting instead of just the same old, same old. I mean, it came out three years ago and it still has a huge following. They've managed to keep the game fresh in a bunch of different ways, they've never asked for a dime, and I'm grateful for it. I wouldn't have 670 hours logged in this damn game if I didn't feel it was worth it .

I agree with this whole heartily. The updates make tf2 interesting every time one comes out. What makes it cool is how valve did them. For instance, on one-hand for the demoman update they made him into a completely different class with the charge n targe demo, and on the other hand they enhanced the defensive part of the demo with the scottish resistance. There was the mistake of making crates only to being able to open with a key that you get at the store, trading with someone who will do that same thing, or deleting them which no one does because of trading. There needs to be a smash button where you can only get the item part of crate so it doesn't seem to be a waste of an item.

I myself have logged 1800 or so hours in this amazing game, and I can't wait to see what's next for it. :biggrin:

 

[ModusPwnens]

I really enjoy the updates, because they change the game play. There's been update after update since I started playing TF2, and it just makes the game that much more interesting. Just when I think I'm getting the hang of it, there seems to be another update. To me this just means that TF2 doesn't get boring. Do I like trading spam? Not really. Do I think the wrangler is cheap? Heck yeah. But like I said, it makes TF2 a lot more enjoyable for me. Less repetitive

 

[Toxxin]

I think the updates are needed to freshen things up although some things they added could of just been done without.

 

[IrateDonnie]

I'm in the middle. I love the updates but sometimes I like to play "vanilla" TF2...That's why I still have my copies of The Orange Box for the 360:blush:, I don't have to worry about Natasha or the Sandman there

 

[Typhus]

Somewhere in the middle.

I love my ubersaw and kritzkrieg, but there are certain unlockables that make me want to punch something...

 

[Donnie the Dinosaur]

Games need to be updated and updates bring new content, even if the tears start flowing *cough* micro-transaction babies *cough*. I like the updates, but i also liked the game at
Orange Box release. So im somewhere in the middle.

 

[Soul_of_a_Sinner]

I think the updates keep a game in check in a way. If a game has no updates then it gets old or boring in some cases nothing ever changes. With updates there are more possibilities within the game and the gameplay

 

[Kamon]

If it wasn't for updates, as much as I love debating how cool, lame, broken, etc. they are, I probably would not be playing the game until this day if it did not update regularly.

Thank the stars for TF2's community.

 

[crazyrockets]

Spidey actually did lots of work on a vanilla server mod. Me and others helped him play-test it, and it works pretty well!
If you want the server info for this vanilla server, you should let me or spidey know, and we should be able to help out out!

Its really fun playing on vanilla tf2!!!

 

[? Frisky Dingo ?]

While I do not think that updates make this game good, I am for updates. I love how this game has evolved into being able to use lots of different playing styles to suit almost everyone. I picked this game up back before the first update came out and haven't put it down since, I have over 3000 hrs played and still love it. Spy was a class I picked up and failed miserably at first, I forced myself to learn how to play spy well and got used to playing it as it was back then. Then the very first update came out for spy and I was mad with the update that made the IW increase cloak time when you picked up ammo it made bad spies decent spies since now they could hide longer, but I learned to like it and adjust my play style to it. Then with the 2 new spy watches I was mad again and disliked both watches but couldn't wait to use them and guess what I learned a different play style with them. Fast forward to present day and I have a different play style for the new spy knife and absolutely love it. I could be like almost everyone else and be mad that they don't know how to learn a different play style or hate the game because these new items make a particular class more OP or just complain in general about the game. I would rather adapt and learn new things and have fun with those who love me backstabbing them .

 

[Angstrom]

Without the sandman I wouldn't have my precious Sandman Taunt Kill gold award in eGO servers. I wouldn't have annoyed the hell out of everyone with my stuns. I was told it was cheap, the cheapest of all. And now what? I've got a fish that lacks the stun but I am still there, annoying everyone.
Yeah, I love the updates.

 

[OSVG]

I'm somewhere in the middle, and will explain in the thread.

The updates have kept TF2 alive. Without the updates TF2 base would be smaller. There were plenty of good additions in terms of game altering performance. Kritz is the best most prudent weapon side grade. The cosmetic aspect is annoying but it keeps you playing. I dont feel like going more in-depth but simply put

Valve does done a mixed job with weapons but the updates have ultimately kept me more attached to the game which makes the updates successful despite what the effects on the TF2 experience are.

 

[DRaGZ]

I think the biggest problem with the updates are that a lot of the unlockables were released without taking into account how they might actually slow down the game instead of making it more fun.

I mean, some weapons LITERALLY slow down the game, like Natascha, and Sandman, but others just create impediments that completely negates any progress until it's removed through an extreme amount of effort, namely the Wrangler.

My problem, mainly, is with the unlocks. I have little beef with the way the items are given out and whatnot.

 

[a pet rock]

Somewhere in the middle. Some of the weapons aren't bad, and some are necessary. I can hardly imagine playing TF2 without a kritzkrieg. That being said, there are so many stupid weapons that it's made me question valve's motives. Maybe they just want to see how much crap we'll put up with before we all rage.

Just going down the list of things I look forward to not missing on vanilla tf2:

FaN, shortstop, natascha, blutsauger, lucksman and lamesman (pee shooter), eternal reward, dead ringer, ambassador, wrangler, gunslinger.

Things I will miss:

kritz.

I just don't think kritz is valuable enough to warrant not trashing the rest of that idiocy. Granted, I said on the fence, so it's close. But that says more about kritz than it does about the other weapons.

 

[Prisoner416]