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And it's only 12$ !
Here is the Steam page: Insurgency on Steam
I already bought the game, and it's beautiful, so help the game grow and let's eventually make it our division again!
Insurgency 2 is on early access! 12$ only!
- Thread starter Ledzo
- Start date
Here is the Steam page: Insurgency on Steam
I already bought the game, and it's beautiful, so help the game grow and let's eventually make it our division again!
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I'll wait till its 10 bucks (Says its 15 bucks for me). It looks just like the old INS. idk just the whole thing of a free game going to payed kinda turns me away.
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Im with dutch on this. Something about a free game going to pay for doesnt always sit right. It started off as a community mod. And thusly should remain so. I understand they poured time and money into it. But hey thats what donations are for.
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There is nothing wrong with taking the concept from what was a free mod and 6 years later developing a stand-alone game and selling it.
There is a lot more development and licensing costs this time around, and there are more people doing this as a job. They should be able to profit from their work.
Paying for alphas and betas is a different issue, but as you didn't pay any money for the mod the first time, what makes you feel cheated about the sequel?
There is a lot more development and licensing costs this time around, and there are more people doing this as a job. They should be able to profit from their work.
Paying for alphas and betas is a different issue, but as you didn't pay any money for the mod the first time, what makes you feel cheated about the sequel?
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The main issue with me is the game appears to be the same exact thing as the first one. Maybe a bit better graphics. That's the only difference i see. I also have seen the videos.
I agree 100% but for me at least; until I play the game firsthand I can't make any judgements.
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The whole gameplay has really changed, now you can upgrade your weapons during a match, as you kill people in a time lapse.
Also, there is a few mods that have been implemented: Realism, Coop(against AI bots).
Furthermore, the game in itself hasn't been fully finished and polished but I think it will be a success, and if we all help during this phase of the development, it will be an even better result.
So instead of waiting and bad mouthing the game, you maybe should try it out and help out the team, and actually do something constructive.
Also, there is a few mods that have been implemented: Realism, Coop(against AI bots).
Furthermore, the game in itself hasn't been fully finished and polished but I think it will be a success, and if we all help during this phase of the development, it will be an even better result.
So instead of waiting and bad mouthing the game, you maybe should try it out and help out the team, and actually do something constructive.
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Fortunately for me, I have a disposable income that I mostly waste on whiskey, nutella, and useless things like a [ame="http://www.amazon.com/SOG-Specialty-Knives-Tactical-Tomahawk/dp/B00438RI7S/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1367161580&sr=8-1&keywords=fasthawk"]SOG tomahawk[/ame] (which is freakin' awesome). I also use this money to buy games that interest me or my fellow gamers-- Insurgency (INS) is not on my radar for purchase at the present time.
My response (and others) may not seem conducive to your train of thought. However, the comments whether in jest or simple statements that outline the game's flaws are helpful to people deciding whether to purchase the game. For some people $15 is two drinks at a bar and an underserved tip to the bartender for a weak whiskey sour; for some people it means begging their parents or saving up for a few weeks to buy this game.
I made a comical comment based on the available media depicting a game that was once a free mod that focused on realism and team-based objectives. Now we are presented with a game that was made by people who completely abandoned the original INS to create a re-skinned, outdated, vanilla version of the game many people in eGO once enjoyed. Even the videos showing gameplay look like a mix of Counterstrike and CoD being run from a dial-up modem with the players having epileptic seizures while trying to shoot at each other through walls. Alpha or not; videos showing gameplay are usually cleaned-up as much as possible to make the game seem as-good or better than it actually is. If the INS videos I have seen so far are a cleaned-up version of the game, then count me out.
Unfortunately, INS (again, as presented in the available media) seems like a grab for money for a flawed, outdated game that pleases neither the original fans of the series nor players new to the franchise (I hope I used "nor" right).
Even though I can afford INS; I won't support it in any way until the developers offer a playable, finished or near-finished product. I know several people who refuse to purchase the game because of the way the original INS was abandoned. If I was into the original INS as much as I have been in other games, then I would also take such a standpoint.
TL;DR
Game looks [crappy]. Buy it if you want. Negative criticism can be as helpful as positive criticism especially when deciding on a purchase.
I don't really know what to think about it, I am happy that they decided to make the game but I don't know if I would buy it with my own money. I have heard from people that have played the new insurgency that it is good, but then agein. I have changed as a gamer since I played insurgency with eGO back in the days. I will see how things turn out when it 100 % complete.
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INS dev team member!! Go INS!
I have a difficult time with this particular issue and am clearly biased as a member of the original dev/testing team..
I have been part of INS since back in when it was true ALPHA v1 back with Endless and Rellik Remag after it was begun by Andrew Spearin. We had a community of developers and testers that was spread across the planet from the US to Belgium, France, Germany. The team were basically enthusiasts of FPS genre games and did it for the love of being involved in something we were doing ourselves but there was no “pay” for doing the work. This was not associated with any official "studio" but pure community driven development. Where some major milestones began to be seen was when Jeremy Blum (founder of the Red Orchestra mod) joined with other RO-OST45 devs. ( basically many of the NWI group are original Devs of Insurgency)
I introduced my web programming students to the game so I could get their feedback as players and took their input back to the team for direct implementation into the games design. It was my unique access to players in our target demographic that attracted the team to me as a member. In fact, it was INS that led me to eventually join =(eGO)= in the first place as a way to drive the games presence/availability through increased exposure within a well-established group. One of my students took over after GardenGrove and DrukenSailor as Div Leader for the INS division and took the reins and helped shape the growth of INS. Without INS there would be NO Ops:X division!
One of the most difficult things was being an admin on the INS servers and not being able to discuss anything due to the NDA we had as dev team members. It was however of huge benefit for me to be able to work with the dev team as a member and be an admin with =(eGO)= as it allowed me to gain direct access to the community and get completely unfiltered access to the real world interaction of players within INS, Including a willingness for them to share exploits within the game that I could take back to the team for immediate fixes. There were a few =(eGO)= on the council that I informed that I was an INS dev team member and asked for their discretion of keeping that out of the public channels, but I felt it was important that they knew I was a developer/tester for INS and would be operating within =(eGO)= if I was going to hold admin rights with the organization within the community. (Thanks to =(eGO)=Jedihitman, =(eGO)=USCGHammer, =(eGO)=HLMaster for your discretion)
The reality is INS began to fail directly to its own success.
After winning MOD of the YEAR, the team began to need more support in the way of finances to continue to push for the release of version 2 (Orange Box release). The game was expanding internally and we were adding entire new components into the system where we were planning to expand the system beyond the basic OPFOR/Marine conflict that it started as under Spearin's original concept. An expansion into British forces as a Coalition forces unit was even in the works. The concept even seemed to spin into the world of ARMA at times. At the same time, we were expanding into an entire new Orange Box engine for the animations and skins. We even released Hidef previews of the models based on the Orange Box platform WAY back in mid 2009. What most don't know or understand is that the lead animator died before that could be completed. Out of respect for his work, the team was hesitant to change his original animation work even though we knew it had flaws and animations were still "stiff" and needed more fluid movements. New models were released, but it was decided that we would NOT touch the original animations, but instead put those changes into the release of version 2 which was going to be based on the ORANGE BOX source engine.
Where things really spun out of control for the project to me, was an attempt to try and become competitive with the likes of Infinity Ward, DICE and EA which are obviously are multi-million dollar big-budget studios. This was of course impossible, but the comparisons were being made there by the community of supporters. With COD-MW, and Battlefield coming on line, Insurgency was often touted as a "free alternative" to those platforms with better realism (Ex: no on-screen cross-hair, no "radar", no health kits, real mag limits) and a better focus on true team effort and less on the CSS style of "Run-n-Gun". Therein lies the beginning of the downward spiral. Forward motion seemed to grind to a halt as we began to “re-invent” and implement new UI's to include load-out systems, gun upgrades , game-play styled to match/ engage and too often I believe personally , pacify players of the “other” big studios interactions (MW/BF/CSS/ARMA, you name it). There seemed to be a loss of control of the project IMO as we became more high profile. Even recently the CEO of one of the major studios was quoted recently how the COD series, particularly the Modern Warfare phases, has corrupted the FPS genre as everyone wants the new games to be "like COD". He was quoted as saying that he couldn't escape that reality even though it annoyed him and that he felt the COD series had created poor players that wanted to just get their fix by having a game make them feel like they were really great players when in fact they were not.
We never truly completed the release of V2 as the team began to fall apart and things got stuck at Beta v2.1 RC2 back in mid 2008. Not because of a bad thing or internal strife in fact it was just the opposite. As we were truly able to do what the big studios were doing, just for free and in our spare time so we as devs/testers became "marketable". People like Xanthi, another of the level designers got hired t by groups like Interwave. As the lead programmers proved their worth to the industry, they left the "free" pro-bono world of Insurgency: MIC for paying jobs in the industry and why not? They created and worked on some HUGE projects such as HL, Borderland, Aliens, RO and other smaller projects. The cost however, was we lost our continuity. We rolled along lost in the desert for a several years with no real purpose anymore to the outside world. As T.S. Elliot said, "Things fall apart.".
We now suddenly leap forward post 2007 MOY award. After an overly effective hiatus, were there was a virtually stalemated interaction and development by Interwave studios, things were basically lost in the world of the MW/BF bloodbath and yearly releases. 3 years later, several of the original devs have now created New World Interactive in 2010 and officially released this past week the long dust binned Version "2" of Insurgency which was effectively parked back in late 2009. The reality is that this was/has always been the plan of so long ago. INS always wanted to become the CSS model of success. Community developed mod meets success story.
Part of the effect of the deep freeze storage of the INS development process has been a reboot and rethink of the entire system in a 2013 world view. Obviously there are some newly developed maps (and removed maps), redesigned game play modes, and the removal of many of the original "Day1" weapons (side effect of the now inescapable MW/BF "perks" system mentality). This is basically a reboot of where thing got left off with the initial 2008-9 Orange BOX INS V2 release phase of development. The "new INS2" look is revealing that conversion to the higher textures of the ORANGE BOX capabilities. They are planning to use the community to help continue develop the system much as we had as there was no such support system back in 2005-2007. The Steam Workshop and early access programs are a huge benefit to the devs now and they apparently intend to take full advantage of that resource.
As to the $14.99 charge for the program, I think that's perfectly reasonable as you are getting a FULL version. Not a Demo, not a limited time trial. So go out there and support them as they have been out there for years (most of it for free). You just have to deal with it going through the Alpha? (really guys, your calling this Alpha after you have already released Beta2 RC2?), "new" Beta and full release phases. That said however, most of the work they are building on was already done by the early dev team for free so I feel it’s reasonable to sell it going forward, but the price truly should be kept well below the $20 mark. Any more than that and it begins to reek more of a money grab using the reputation and loyalty of the players and basically handing them a "BETA" , but claiming its "Alpha". Let’s keep it real on this one. INS has been in development since 2005 and they know that as many in NWI has been there since the beginning. It may be ALPHA for newly formed NWI as an “official” studio and they may be putting their success on the line for INS, but the truth is they already had most of the "ALPHA" work done for long before they got the steam community involved in this “Early Access” so let’s be truthful.
Now I have to say before someone decides to tear me a new one, that is not to discredit the people that have been there and stuck things out. I phased out from the dev team back around mid-2010 when things looked like they were going to be lost under the pressure of the big two (MW/ BF). People like Argyll and the NWI devs (Spearin (Founder)Blum, Hickenbottom, Stock, Schmidt, Hamilton) from the original INS team have been a huge factor in making INS stay alive from the community perspective and this is in NO WAY meant as any disparagement on their huge efforts or others that have been very influential so I don't want anyone thinking I'm saying there is not some serious credit where credit is due in any way. My concern is the studios need to be fair to those that have been long time supporters and treat them with respect and realize that they have been seriously patient in waiting for INS to go full release.
As a side note, It would also be nice for those on the early dev/testing teams able to at least get a shout out for the early work we did on helping design levels, improve gameplay, test, debug, and overall be a group of really dedicated supporters who were part of something that looks like it is finally going to get some traction (perhaps at least a listing in the credits for the testers??). We were there through those early days with you in the trenches too….. ;-) Kudos to the NWI guys for sticking this one out and I wish the team all the success in their new endeavor. Just don’t forgot those who fell on the battlefield and helped get you there!!
=(eG)=Vanwhittle - Offical INS Tester group
I have a difficult time with this particular issue and am clearly biased as a member of the original dev/testing team..
I have been part of INS since back in when it was true ALPHA v1 back with Endless and Rellik Remag after it was begun by Andrew Spearin. We had a community of developers and testers that was spread across the planet from the US to Belgium, France, Germany. The team were basically enthusiasts of FPS genre games and did it for the love of being involved in something we were doing ourselves but there was no “pay” for doing the work. This was not associated with any official "studio" but pure community driven development. Where some major milestones began to be seen was when Jeremy Blum (founder of the Red Orchestra mod) joined with other RO-OST45 devs. ( basically many of the NWI group are original Devs of Insurgency)
I introduced my web programming students to the game so I could get their feedback as players and took their input back to the team for direct implementation into the games design. It was my unique access to players in our target demographic that attracted the team to me as a member. In fact, it was INS that led me to eventually join =(eGO)= in the first place as a way to drive the games presence/availability through increased exposure within a well-established group. One of my students took over after GardenGrove and DrukenSailor as Div Leader for the INS division and took the reins and helped shape the growth of INS. Without INS there would be NO Ops:X division!
One of the most difficult things was being an admin on the INS servers and not being able to discuss anything due to the NDA we had as dev team members. It was however of huge benefit for me to be able to work with the dev team as a member and be an admin with =(eGO)= as it allowed me to gain direct access to the community and get completely unfiltered access to the real world interaction of players within INS, Including a willingness for them to share exploits within the game that I could take back to the team for immediate fixes. There were a few =(eGO)= on the council that I informed that I was an INS dev team member and asked for their discretion of keeping that out of the public channels, but I felt it was important that they knew I was a developer/tester for INS and would be operating within =(eGO)= if I was going to hold admin rights with the organization within the community. (Thanks to =(eGO)=Jedihitman, =(eGO)=USCGHammer, =(eGO)=HLMaster for your discretion)
The reality is INS began to fail directly to its own success.
After winning MOD of the YEAR, the team began to need more support in the way of finances to continue to push for the release of version 2 (Orange Box release). The game was expanding internally and we were adding entire new components into the system where we were planning to expand the system beyond the basic OPFOR/Marine conflict that it started as under Spearin's original concept. An expansion into British forces as a Coalition forces unit was even in the works. The concept even seemed to spin into the world of ARMA at times. At the same time, we were expanding into an entire new Orange Box engine for the animations and skins. We even released Hidef previews of the models based on the Orange Box platform WAY back in mid 2009. What most don't know or understand is that the lead animator died before that could be completed. Out of respect for his work, the team was hesitant to change his original animation work even though we knew it had flaws and animations were still "stiff" and needed more fluid movements. New models were released, but it was decided that we would NOT touch the original animations, but instead put those changes into the release of version 2 which was going to be based on the ORANGE BOX source engine.
Where things really spun out of control for the project to me, was an attempt to try and become competitive with the likes of Infinity Ward, DICE and EA which are obviously are multi-million dollar big-budget studios. This was of course impossible, but the comparisons were being made there by the community of supporters. With COD-MW, and Battlefield coming on line, Insurgency was often touted as a "free alternative" to those platforms with better realism (Ex: no on-screen cross-hair, no "radar", no health kits, real mag limits) and a better focus on true team effort and less on the CSS style of "Run-n-Gun". Therein lies the beginning of the downward spiral. Forward motion seemed to grind to a halt as we began to “re-invent” and implement new UI's to include load-out systems, gun upgrades , game-play styled to match/ engage and too often I believe personally , pacify players of the “other” big studios interactions (MW/BF/CSS/ARMA, you name it). There seemed to be a loss of control of the project IMO as we became more high profile. Even recently the CEO of one of the major studios was quoted recently how the COD series, particularly the Modern Warfare phases, has corrupted the FPS genre as everyone wants the new games to be "like COD". He was quoted as saying that he couldn't escape that reality even though it annoyed him and that he felt the COD series had created poor players that wanted to just get their fix by having a game make them feel like they were really great players when in fact they were not.
We never truly completed the release of V2 as the team began to fall apart and things got stuck at Beta v2.1 RC2 back in mid 2008. Not because of a bad thing or internal strife in fact it was just the opposite. As we were truly able to do what the big studios were doing, just for free and in our spare time so we as devs/testers became "marketable". People like Xanthi, another of the level designers got hired t by groups like Interwave. As the lead programmers proved their worth to the industry, they left the "free" pro-bono world of Insurgency: MIC for paying jobs in the industry and why not? They created and worked on some HUGE projects such as HL, Borderland, Aliens, RO and other smaller projects. The cost however, was we lost our continuity. We rolled along lost in the desert for a several years with no real purpose anymore to the outside world. As T.S. Elliot said, "Things fall apart.".
We now suddenly leap forward post 2007 MOY award. After an overly effective hiatus, were there was a virtually stalemated interaction and development by Interwave studios, things were basically lost in the world of the MW/BF bloodbath and yearly releases. 3 years later, several of the original devs have now created New World Interactive in 2010 and officially released this past week the long dust binned Version "2" of Insurgency which was effectively parked back in late 2009. The reality is that this was/has always been the plan of so long ago. INS always wanted to become the CSS model of success. Community developed mod meets success story.
Part of the effect of the deep freeze storage of the INS development process has been a reboot and rethink of the entire system in a 2013 world view. Obviously there are some newly developed maps (and removed maps), redesigned game play modes, and the removal of many of the original "Day1" weapons (side effect of the now inescapable MW/BF "perks" system mentality). This is basically a reboot of where thing got left off with the initial 2008-9 Orange BOX INS V2 release phase of development. The "new INS2" look is revealing that conversion to the higher textures of the ORANGE BOX capabilities. They are planning to use the community to help continue develop the system much as we had as there was no such support system back in 2005-2007. The Steam Workshop and early access programs are a huge benefit to the devs now and they apparently intend to take full advantage of that resource.
As to the $14.99 charge for the program, I think that's perfectly reasonable as you are getting a FULL version. Not a Demo, not a limited time trial. So go out there and support them as they have been out there for years (most of it for free). You just have to deal with it going through the Alpha? (really guys, your calling this Alpha after you have already released Beta2 RC2?), "new" Beta and full release phases. That said however, most of the work they are building on was already done by the early dev team for free so I feel it’s reasonable to sell it going forward, but the price truly should be kept well below the $20 mark. Any more than that and it begins to reek more of a money grab using the reputation and loyalty of the players and basically handing them a "BETA" , but claiming its "Alpha". Let’s keep it real on this one. INS has been in development since 2005 and they know that as many in NWI has been there since the beginning. It may be ALPHA for newly formed NWI as an “official” studio and they may be putting their success on the line for INS, but the truth is they already had most of the "ALPHA" work done for long before they got the steam community involved in this “Early Access” so let’s be truthful.
Now I have to say before someone decides to tear me a new one, that is not to discredit the people that have been there and stuck things out. I phased out from the dev team back around mid-2010 when things looked like they were going to be lost under the pressure of the big two (MW/ BF). People like Argyll and the NWI devs (Spearin (Founder)Blum, Hickenbottom, Stock, Schmidt, Hamilton) from the original INS team have been a huge factor in making INS stay alive from the community perspective and this is in NO WAY meant as any disparagement on their huge efforts or others that have been very influential so I don't want anyone thinking I'm saying there is not some serious credit where credit is due in any way. My concern is the studios need to be fair to those that have been long time supporters and treat them with respect and realize that they have been seriously patient in waiting for INS to go full release.
As a side note, It would also be nice for those on the early dev/testing teams able to at least get a shout out for the early work we did on helping design levels, improve gameplay, test, debug, and overall be a group of really dedicated supporters who were part of something that looks like it is finally going to get some traction (perhaps at least a listing in the credits for the testers??). We were there through those early days with you in the trenches too….. ;-) Kudos to the NWI guys for sticking this one out and I wish the team all the success in their new endeavor. Just don’t forgot those who fell on the battlefield and helped get you there!!
=(eG)=Vanwhittle - Offical INS Tester group
Last edited:
- Joined
- Apr 14, 2009
- Messages
- 3,745
That would usually be my job. However, you gave a lot of insight to fans of the original INS that might change some of their thoughts on the developers of INS.
I wasn't so clear in my response but I should emphasize that the choice to buy the new INS is up to them. I merely presented my own thoughts, observations of the new game, and commented on some of the perceptions surrounding the new INS and the way the original was abandoned.
I understand you were close to a lot of the people who worked on INS and they (and you) deserved the credit of earning MOY. Unfortunately, the game was ultimately abandoned and the players essentially left with their [hopes] in their hand. Like you mentioned, a lot of the developers found jobs in the industry but the result was still the same; players were abandoned and a game was left to rot.
Now years later some of the developers present a game that (by your own account) is using content from 2009 to 2011 (in addition to new content) running on the free beta mod v2.1 and wanting to charge $15 for this "new" mod.
Yes, everyone needs to earn a living but I think this move was just another slap in the face to the original diehard INS fans on top of changing the dynamics of the game, changing the gameplay of the game, making that game vanilla, and INS' history of abandoning its fans. INS fans didn't play INS because it was like CSS, they played it because it was something unique. Now, INS fans are presented with a game that is INS in name only and is a mix of CSS, CoD, and BF-- I fail to see why people who loved the original INS would even want to waste the time downloading and installing the new INS even if it was free.
