algebra

Sgt.Saputo

Rookie Poster
Am I the only one who thinks getting shot is less painful that trying to understand algebra? I watched a video on the 10 dimensions and understood it perfectly, but when I got a calculator to help with algebra the instructions looked like some kind of un-crackable government cypher for launch codes to the nuclear arsenal. :facewall:

I know there most be others like me, or maybe not....
 

Grimm911

Posting Commander
Its one thing to just watch a video and just understand what they mean.

It is another to actually go into detail and do algebraic calculations.

I'm almost afraid of the math i have to do since i want to major in engineering. Stuff like Calculus 3 and linear algebra seem like it will be tough when i get to them (if i even decide to)
 

Sgt.Saputo

Rookie Poster
Math, it is one of my few fears. Know why? Because the problems can not be solved with large amounts of explosives or rifle fire, most other problems can :p
 

Frank Booth

EGO Is My Life!
Algebra is rather easy. You may be approaching it wrong. What about it do you find difficult?

Lagrange's goal in Mathematics was to reduce everything to algebraic operations. And that says a lot.
 
Last edited:

Sgt.Saputo

Rookie Poster
Algebra is rather easy. You may be approaching it wrong. What about it do you find difficult?

Lagrange's goal in Mathematics was to reduce everything to algebraic operations. And that says a lot.
I just flat out don't get it : / I understand basic math just fine, but algebra just makes me want to find the nearest 4 lane and jump rope in it xD My dad never understood it in school nor did my mom. I can hit a target 1/4 the size of a dime from around 100 yards away but I can't understand algebra xD I guess that's why I'm joining the Marines and not becoming an rocket scientist :p
 

TheyCallMeC

EGO Is My Life!
which kind of algebra?

the kind you learn in middle school, the kind you learn in highschool, or the advanced stuff in college?
 

Frank Booth

EGO Is My Life!
Well, there is actually no difference. All is based on 12 rules, out of which about 8 are what you would call axioms. That is all there is too it, but they are not taught the right way. If you understand those 12 rules you can do almost anything in algebra.


which kind of algebra?

the kind you learn in middle school, the kind you learn in highschool, or the advanced stuff in college?
 

Grimm911

Posting Commander
Well, there is actually no difference. All is based on 12 rules, out of which about 8 are what you would call axioms. That is all there is too it, but they are not taught the right way. If you understand those 12 rules you can do almost anything in algebra.
I am an engineering major and i do not think in any of my math courses the have mentioned the 12 rules, maybe back in HS and middle school it was mentioned. But i dont remember lol. I agree that it is taught the wrong way, i end up having to figure things out on my own and have on of those "oooh, now i get it," moments.
 

RAFIKI

Website Brigadier
in math class i had great grades. but then again that was because i had a friend do my work for me. ;)
 

Frank Booth

EGO Is My Life!
They are all a variation on Peano's axioms. If you can find a copy of Spivak's Calculus he covers them extremely well. The best reference i know of is Euler's Elements of Algebra, though i have yet to compare it to Lagrange's book on Algebra.

The first nine rules.

a+0=0+a=a
a*1=a

a+(-a)=(-a)+a=0
a*(1/a)=(1/a)*a=1, a=/o

a+b=b+a
a+(b+c)=(a+b)+c
a*(b*c)=(a*b)*c

a*b=b*a
a*(b+c)=a*b+a*c

There are three more rules.

Trichotomy: For every number a, one and only one of the following holds.
a=0, a is in the collection P, -a is in the collection P.

Closure under addition:
If a and b are in P, a+b is in P

Closure under multiplication:
If a and b are in P, a*b is in P.




I am an engineering major and i do not think in any of my math courses the have mentioned the 12 rules, maybe back in HS and middle school it was mentioned. But i dont remember lol. I agree that it is taught the wrong way, i end up having to figure things out on my own and have on of those "oooh, now i get it," moments.
 

Grimm911

Posting Commander
^ Those all make a lot of sense.

Would be great if this was taught early on, it does make it simpler than most teachers make it out to be.
 

TheyCallMeC

EGO Is My Life!
anyway i hate math as it is

i prefer history

history is awesome because theres no problem solving

no rules to it

you just learn about stuff that has already happened

that and you dont have that totally BS moment you get in math
you know
where you FINALLY understand what the teacher is talking about
about 2 days after theyve explained it
then they go and give you a bunch of exceptions to that rule you barely understood in the first place
so that youre even more confused than when you first started to learn it
 

DragonD

The Division of None
I just flat out don't get it : / I understand basic math just fine, but algebra just makes me want to find the nearest 4 lane and jump rope in it xD My dad never understood it in school nor did my mom. I can hit a target 1/4 the size of a dime from around 100 yards away but I can't understand algebra xD I guess that's why I'm joining the Marines and not becoming an rocket scientist :p
My undergrad is in computer science and my masters is in software engineering. Lets just say I've had LOOOOTS of math.

What your doing there in high school is called "Classical Algebra" (finding unknown numbers). One of the "upper" math classes i took in college was Abstract Algebra (studying rings, fields-space & time).

I understand that the phrase "difficult" is relative to each person..but there is really nothing hard about classical algebra. The concepts are old...i mean..old old. What your studying now, was first developed by the ancient Babylonians, they could even solve quadratic equations, using the same methods your learning now. And that was like 4,000 years ago...think about that for just a min.

Why is it important to study it?

Because while your shooting at that target 100 yards away, the guy who studied the math is guiding a non-manned drone your way to drop a missile on you.

Is higher math for everybody? Of course not...SOMEBODY has to be on the ground to drop the missiles on!
 

Sgt.Saputo

Rookie Poster
My undergrad is in computer science and my masters is in software engineering. Lets just say I've had LOOOOTS of math.

What your doing there in high school is called "Classical Algebra" (finding unknown numbers). One of the "upper" math classes i took in college was Abstract Algebra (studying rings, fields-space & time).

I understand that the phrase "difficult" is relative to each person..but there is really nothing hard about classical algebra. The concepts are old...i mean..old old. What your studying now, was first developed by the ancient Babylonians, they could even solve quadratic equations, using the same methods your learning now. And that was like 4,000 years ago...think about that for just a min.

Why is it important to study it?

Because while your shooting at that target 100 yards away, the guy who studied the math is guiding a non-manned drone your way to drop a missile on you.

Is higher math for everybody? Of course not...SOMEBODY has to be on the ground to drop the missiles on!


Maybe if the teachers at the school I useto go to (Stupid christian private school) would have taken the time to explain it instead of "Here it is, good luck." I might not be so confused. If I ever get to do my job as a Marine, I mean my REAL job, I won't survive long enough to have to worry about that drone. The life expectancy of a Marine who gets to do his job the correct way is somewhere around 15 mins. There may be a lot of amazing technology in war today, but there will never be a replacement for a USMC Rifleman. :)
 

NinjaWuuzoku

Website Brigadier
It's werid, I'm a mastermind at Algebra.. but I CANNOT do Geometry for my life.
It's just how people are, my best friend is terrible at algebra, I used to do all his homework for him, and I passed Algebra with a 98%. I passed Geometry with a 70%.
It's a simple thing, you just have to see through it and realize what your doing
 
Top