For all the huntsman snipers:

[firestrike24]

Yeah, and there are spies that disguise as their own team too. It doesn't mean that everyone should do it.

You realize any good spy will know how to use a friendly disguise?

That is kind of my point though, any decently skilled sniper should be able to use the rifle in the same environment and situations as any huntsman sniper.

Aside from the faster charge time on the huntsman, the better rate of fire, the better anti-sg...

I'll shoot him in the head, dance around him with the kukri. Problem solved.

Objection for reliance on enemy stupidity, any half-decent heavy will shred yuo long before then.

 

[KuNai]

@ OP: Huntsman doesn't have anything on the Snipers featured in the video. Also, I've seen how people say that the huntsman is for "close-medium" combat only. Yet, many Snipers still stay way in the back similar to that of most rifled Snipers.

Any decent Soldier, Demo, Heavy or Scout can take down a huntsman Sniper in CQC. Huntsman Snipers will lose almost every time.

I despise Huntsman snipers who just spam down narrow corridors just to get kills, and most of the time, they don't aim.

 

[DRaGZ]

I disagree. I've done it several time. You under estimate the skill level of myself and several other rifle snipers. Which is fine with me, I'll take it as a compliment.

You were fighting dumb heavies. It's not your skill, it's their lack of it. Any decent Heavy would taken you out right as you were switching to your Kukri. You're probably also only recalling those rare moments where such a tactic actually worked, not all those times an ambushing Heavy took you out and you pushed it out of your memory as you wait to respawn.

@ OP: Huntsman doesn't have anything on the Snipers featured in the video. Also, I've seen how people say that the huntsman is for "close-medium" combat only. Yet, many Snipers still stay way in the back similar to that of most rifled Snipers.

Any decent Soldier, Demo, Heavy or Scout can take down a huntsman Sniper in CQC. Huntsman Snipers will lose almost every time.

I despise Huntsman snipers who just spam down narrow corridors just to get kills, and most of the time, they don't aim.

They're doing it wrong.

The main problem is that people think it's just a different kind of Sniper Rifle. It really isn't, it changes the class altogether.

 

[xXracecarXx]

Yes, the huntsman and the sniper rifle are very different weapons and should be treated as such. Both weapons have there pros and cons. I personally believe the rifle has more pros than cons. The reload is MUCH faster for the rifle, but the charge for the huntsman is also faster. However, you do see WAY more pro sniper rifle snipers than you do with huntsman snipers.
In theory if you can COMPLETELY understand and master the parabolic arrow and velocity, and everything else that makes huntman aiming a harder, then yes they can become equal if not better than the sniper rifle. (but that is un-human like)But because the huntsman has more "obsticles" if you will for better aim doesn't necessarily make it a lesser weapon. It just makes it much harder to use for the user, making it seem like a lesser weapon."
However, I'd pick the sniper rifle because realistically no huntsman sniper can out do the best sniper rifler, when it comes to aim consistency. But I guess that's debatable, As I'm sure someone is going to think differently.

 

[M.c.P]

Hmph, I KNOW there are players that can, and have, dominated games with a huntsman. Evil Smilie, an e in eGO, comes to mind. Mind you, he didn't stand out quite as much on a game with both Hex and Nurse, but without his support, I assure you Hex and Nurse wouldn't have been as successful as they were. (as in, he always kills me when I was ready to ambush them in the Turbine vents)

And the reason you don't see huntsman skill vids is because the huntsman is banned in competitive play, where most of those skill vids come from.

eh, huntsman has got an excellent DPS even if you only use bodyshots. The sniper rifle can do better, but only with consistent headshots. Then huntsman has a travel time, sure, but its a fast one, and like all shots with a travel time, it gets much easier to aim the closer you get.

 

[Sabion]

Hmph, I KNOW there are players that can, and have, dominated games with a huntsman. Evil Smilie, an e in eGO, comes to mind. Mind you, he didn't stand out quite as much on a game with both Hex and Nurse, but without his support, I assure you Hex and Nurse wouldn't have been as successful as they were. (as in, he always kills me when I was ready to ambush them in the Turbine vents)

Not to put Evil down or anything as he is a great player, but from what Ive seen when I played with him, he just camps vents and randomly fires down when he sees Hex and Nurse coming down the vent. He just pops out from around the corner and fires quickly and hopes it hits Hex in the head to do major damage if not kill Hex...This is the best example as to why people hate the huntsman so much and why people bash it so much...This is a good way to use the huntsman but its a poor way to try and back up the skill needed in using the huntsman.

 

[firestrike24]

@ OP: Huntsman doesn't have anything on the Snipers featured in the video. Also, I've seen how people say that the huntsman is for "close-medium" combat only. Yet, many Snipers still stay way in the back similar to that of most rifled Snipers.

Any decent Soldier, Demo, Heavy or Scout can take down a huntsman Sniper in CQC. Huntsman Snipers will lose almost every time.

I despise Huntsman snipers who just spam down narrow corridors just to get kills, and most of the time, they don't aim.

I reject this point on the grounds that your argument is based on poor play and substitute my own.

And the reason you don't see huntsman skill vids is because the huntsman is banned in competitive play, where most of those skill vids come from.

eh, huntsman has got an excellent DPS even if you only use bodyshots. The sniper rifle can do better, but only with consistent headshots. Then huntsman has a travel time, sure, but its a fast one, and like all shots with a travel time, it gets much easier to aim the closer you get.

There you go guys, the huntsman is just like a rocket launcher, and it's banned on comp play, as I have stated before, the huntsman was once considered a pocket replacement.

 

[Green Lantern]

i prefer the rifle because it is SNIPING, if you want to fight in a closer way
play another class!

if an enemy comes to close you can either use your meelee or your SMG
the huntsman is for just a lamer weapon

 

[M.c.P]

Sabion, I was referring to a game where smilie was on the same team as Hex and Nurse, and I was on the opposing team. And, as far as I could tell, Smilie had the reflexes, prediction, and quick aiming necessary to enable Hex and Nurse to do far more damage than they would have otherwise. He used the huntsman and Jarate like a pro: medium range support to help his teammates roll the opposition, and using arrows to eliminate problem units quickly. It was an excellent bit of teamwork that was hard to dislodge and harder to stop.

And, well, I find the huntsman a lot more FUN to use than the rifle. Sticking and moving, picking out targets, and moving close to the pack. You can Conceivably do it with a rifle, but that takes the kind of time investment that I am unable and unwilling to put into a computer game, especially such a limited facet of it.

 

[Maj.Emish]

you can pin people with the huntsman

/thread

 

[LuxMortim]

You were fighting dumb heavies. It's not your skill, it's their lack of it. Any decent Heavy would taken you out right as you were switching to your Kukri. You're probably also only recalling those rare moments where such a tactic actually worked, not all those times an ambushing Heavy took you out and you pushed it out of your memory as you wait to respawn.

You'd like to think that would be the case, wouldn't you.

I reject this point on the grounds that your argument is based on poor play and substitute my own.

What a poor substitution...

you can pin people with the huntsman

/thread

You can try, Emish, but 10/10 you'll lose your head before you kill an opposing sniper.

 

[Sabion]

Sabion, I was referring to a game where smilie was on the same team as Hex and Nurse, and I was on the opposing team. And, as far as I could tell, Smilie had the reflexes, prediction, and quick aiming necessary to enable Hex and Nurse to do far more damage than they would have otherwise. He used the huntsman and Jarate like a pro: medium range support to help his teammates roll the opposition, and using arrows to eliminate problem units quickly. It was an excellent bit of teamwork that was hard to dislodge and harder to stop.

That may be so, but if he was in vents while he was doing this, since Hex loves to rush vents, then ANY archer can fire down the vent with so-called quick reflexes...As for aiming...You just shoot straight down the vent since you cant dodge the arrow and all archers just quickly pop around the corner and shoot so the quick aiming is also voided...If he wasn't in vents while this happened and was rather fighting near intel/middle, then that deserves credit but shooting down a vent takes little to no skill in my opinion...Anyone can do it and get kills...

 

[DUCE]

I'd much rather be headshot by a rifle sniper than a huntsman sniper. The hunstman's hitbox is way too generous for headshots. I admit i'm a terrible sniper and I usually let out a cry of surprise whenever I do get a rifle headshot. Most of the headshots i've gotten with a huntsman involves just randomly firing it in the general direction of people.

 

[M.c.P]

What maps do you huntsman haters play? If they tend to involve lots of long, narrow, hallways *cough Blackmesa cough*, then maybe you should think about trying some more open maps.

LuxMortem, that's no rebuttal at all. Saying things amounting to "Nuh-uh, YOU'RE wrong" isn't going to convince anyone, and Echelon and Dragz did make good points. Do you mean to say you consistently kill people jumping you at close ranges, heavies, scouts, et. all? Do they include some of the better players who frequent eGO servers, and once again, I stress, do you do it consistently?

Besides, I've gotten plenty of satisfaction from huntsman shots. Its the satisfaction that comes from making a good prediction of enemy movements, and accounting for it well enough to get shots off at longer ranges.

In any case, I'd never get in a snipe fight with a rifleman. Of COURSE I'd lose. It's like saying the flaregun sucks because it can't kill other pyros as effectively, or that the scout sucks because he can't take out sentries very easily. Facing rifleman snipers, I send a few quick shot arrows to keep their heads down, and try to get out of his killzone. I'm not equipped to take him out, so I'll avoid him until I can either get the advantage or someone else kills him.

 

[DRaGZ]

In any case, I'd never get in a snipe fight with a rifleman. Of COURSE I'd lose. It's like saying the flaregun sucks because it can't kill other pyros as effectively, or that the scout sucks because he can't take out sentries very easily. Facing rifleman snipers, I send a few quick shot arrows to keep their heads down, and try to get out of his killzone. I'm not equipped to take him out, so I'll avoid him until I can either get the advantage or someone else kills him.

Personally, I play a lot of 2Fort. Like...almost nothing but 2Fort. But the Huntsman is also pretty dang useful in Turbine, from what I have experienced. Not just in the vents, but in the lower room/hallway leading to the intel room.

And yeah, one of the biggest downsides to the Huntsman in that you are now useless against an aware Sniper Rifler.

That said, there are better ways for dealing with a Sniper than another Sniper (unless you are significantly better than the other Sniper).

 

[firestrike24]

What a poor substitution...

Well his argument was based on poor play of the huntsman sniper, so it's perfectly alright to reject it as I have; incidentally, it's in violation of rule 18: Reliance on enemy stupidity.

You can try, Emish, but 10/10 you'll lose your head before you kill an opposing sniper.

So countersniping is one thing which the rifle is better at, but you've failed to consider everything else.

I have dozens of other reasons to post here, but I'll save them for when you try and defend your impossible stance...

 

[M.c.P]

I just realized Echelon is the ubercharged contributor I've enjoyed reading recently.

...

 

[LuxMortim]

So countersniping is one thing which the rifle is better at, but you've failed to consider everything else.

That's my point. The rifle can be better, and in the right hands, is better than the huntsman in almost every single situation I've considered.

 

[QB]

/Thread.

This thread has devolved into people rejecting arguments out of hand. I've played with/against the BEST snipers in TF2, and they all recognize the situational benefits of using the huntsman. It's just another tool in the box, and apparently some people can't recognize that.

 

[Lance]

Of course the rifle is better for most people most of the time, but the huntsman is still more FUN, which makes it worthwhile to me.