GTA V RP - Remove Greenzones - Protect Jobs

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Cryptic Strolski

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I am suggesting a removal of Greenzones from all locations with the exception of the Police Departments. In exchange, I suggest a rule exist that protects EMS, Dealers and Mechanics from being attacked while in their establishments, but allowing clients of those jobs to be fair game.

I feel that too much of the community gathers in these Greenzones leaving little to no room for actual conflict to arise outside of with PD itself on the streets. It makes jobs like private security very unexciting when people simply have meetings in safe zones rather than somewhere they can be targeted.

That's just my opinion.
 
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Even if those greenzones are turned off and we say dealers/mechanics are off the table, what's stopping them from protecting their turf and shooting you as you try to rob their clients? Or is the goal to have PD/Security companies at these locations 24/7, essentially creating a green zone.

I figured out what you meant, they would need to agree not to do so? Honestly I feel like you are pointing out unrealistic flaws in this. A car dealership or a mechanic shop is most likely not going to gun down a guy robbing the store because most of them don't carry guns at their shop or jobs. And no, I don't support 24/7 security, nobody wants that job. How many car dealers or mechanic shops do you know that maintain a security presence? I've never seen a single one. Same goes for parking garages.

BUT, if you wanted to stretch here and allow them to defend their turf, they now make themselves a potential target by getting involved, I say they become fair game if they can't stay out of the conflict.
 
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Even if those greenzones are turned off and we say dealers/mechanics are off the table, what's stopping them from protecting their turf and shooting you as you try to rob their clients? Or is the goal to have PD/Security companies at these locations 24/7, essentially creating a green zone.

Do car dealers usually carry guns in America?
 
I figured out what you meant, they would need to agree not to do so? Honestly I feel like you are pointing out unrealistic flaws in this. A car dealership or a mechanic shop is most likely not going to gun down a guy robbing the store because most of them don't carry guns at their shop or jobs. And no, I don't support 24/7 security, nobody wants that job. How many car dealers or mechanic shops do you know that maintain a security presence? I've never seen a single one. Same goes for parking garages.

BUT, if you wanted to stretch here and allow them to defend their turf, they now make themselves a potential target by getting involved, I say they become fair game if they can't stay out of the conflict.

So if you come and hold their client up at gun point they're supposed to look away?

Also considering the crime rates in the city right now I would say it's quite realistic for most people to be armed.
 
So if you come and hold their client up at gun point they're supposed to look away?

It would be unrealistic for car dealers to be packing first off, I've never met a single one who was allowed to carry a firearm at work. Secondly, I explained how you solve that. If the dealer wants to defend the client, they become fair game, that seems pretty realistic to me.

Also considering the crime rates in the city right now I would say it's quite realistic for most people to be armed.

Like I said in my second sentence. The dealer choosing to defend the client is the dealer making the choice to enter that roleplay scenario and they will face the consequences of doing so good or bad.
 
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Crime rates are already high enough to put Detroit to shame, I dont think we need more reason to commit crime.

Maybe when AI call 911 to report crimes in progress, and the default response to someone with a gun is call 911 instead of try to gun them down, it will make sense to revisit green zones.
 
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I personally have multiple opinions on this subject and similar subjects. On this topic i feel that removal of greenzone's will benefit many people. and it will make many people mad if they get shot inside a circle that they cant really defend them self at. I feel rp situations and killing should be allowed but its a grey area if they're inside the circle trying to pull a car out. or put one away. On another subject I would like to see some rdm rule exceptions such as a gang war. Also i would like to have a situation where your intent is to kill someone, like a hitman and would think if you have a hit on someone and you know what they look like you should be able to shoot them without initiation, this would add some use to sniper rifles as only use is basically having coverage during a robbery, and even that is a grey area because the sniper himself didn't initiate.
 
Another solution, since you don't want these individuals messed with while on duty is to add an on and off duty option for their organizations, on duty gives dealers and mechanics god mode. No reason that should be an advantage since they are not allowed to be attacked anyway right? Bit of a stretch but I'm spitballing here..

If they are godmode then they wouldnt be able to defend their establishment either because it would be a one ended fight.
 
What greenzones at the dealership and garage and mechanic shop have in turn created is a bunch of afk people bored with nothing to do.
Removing green zones wont stop people from afking. It's not like you can rob someone who is afk and killing someone who is afk doesnt accomplish anything.
 
If they are godmode then they wouldnt be able to defend their establishment either because it would be a one ended fight.

That was one of many options, but yes, if the god mode idea was used, they would be required to stay out of the scenario.
 
Removing green zones wont stop people from afking. It's not like you can rob someone who is afk and killing someone who is afk doesnt accomplish anything.

The point is that if you remove the greenzones people won't feel comfortable going afk out of boredom, there will constantly be things going on in these areas, it will encourage more interaction.
 
The point is that if you remove the greenzones people won't feel comfortable going afk out of boredom, there will constantly be things going on in these areas, it will encourage more interaction.

It will only encourage them to find somewhere else go afk.


Lets get down to the basics: what problem is currently going that such a change would remedy.
 
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No one will ever have God Mod unless they are cheating.

That was a given, but like I said initially, it was a stretch spitball idea among many which I have provided here.

It will only encourage them to find somewhere else go afk.


Lets get down to the basics: what problem is currently going that such a change would remedy.

The most basic issue is we have made the highest traffic zones, the garage, the mechanic shop and the dealership all greenzones. This is where the majority of server interactions occur. Everyone hangs out here because:

A. Everyone is there via mechanics that put them there
B. They know they can't be touched so they feel it's the best place to hang out and meet/interact with people

In turn, you come into the server and you find a bunch of people sitting at the garage. Aside from interactions with police for breaking the law, there's really not much of a reason for civilians to interact outside of these locations. I know the suggestion has been brought forth to add a new hangout location while leaving the greenzones the way they are. The worst case scenario outcome of this solution is that the new hangout spot will become this desolate crime ridden slaughter/troll fest that you guys claim the garage would become if the greenzone was removed. So your new hangout spot would inevitably become yet another greenzone by this logic. The best case scenario, the new hang out spot is only used for roleplay just as every other spot is now and nobody really goes there naturally because mechanics don't drive them there and they'd rather hang out in a safe spot where they can sit around without worrying about getting robbed. So I really don't understand the logic there.

Mechanics in place drive the population of the server to interact at specific locations. The three biggest of these locations in order are The Garage, The Dealership and The Mechanic Shop. If you look anywhere else, unless there's an event, you won't really find more than one person in a random spot and chances are most likely they will avoid another civilian out of fear of getting mugged.

So ultimately all the greenzones have done is lower the interaction possibilities in these most popular locations, in turn lowering the amount of things to do and the potential RP to be had. Yes, crime is roleplay, as much as a lot of people seem to want to claim it's not, getting mugged, blackmailed, threatened, and kidnapped IS roleplay. It creates conflict that gives not only the criminal something to RP, but the victim as well. It then in turn provides the police department and EMS roleplay opportunities to respond to these situations. It also provides a company like mine the opportunity to help prevent these situations via being hired to escort individuals whilst they are carrying higher value items they don't want lost.

A few have claimed there will be low effort RP or griefing if greenzones are lifted. As Rekty said, these situations should be admin'd just as they are now. By not whitelisting the server, we are bound to have a large number of these instances no matter what. I fully support having a public access server, don't get me wrong, but this is what happens when it is public. Solving the problem by limiting everyone's RP opportunities because of the actions of rule breakers is not a solution, it's a bandaid, one that makes the already difficult life of criminals an even more difficult and unentertaining one.

By lifting the greenzones but having a rule in place that protects the jobs at the dealer and mechanics when they are on site on duty would be a better solution to this.(This is assuming greenzones remain for all Emergency Service locations)

Additional note: I want everybody to keep in mind that it is at the very least my goal to see the server progress and expand, that's why I argue my points to so much depth, that's why I try to respond to every argument against my points. It's nothing personal when I disagree with you, I simply want to make sure we've exhausted every possibility before we resort to blanket solutions that potentially make things worse for some people while making them better for others. I don't make these suggestions just to benefit me. Yes, more crime would benefit security, but at the end of the day, more interactions for civilians benefit everyone. As it stands, Emergency services always have work to do, it's what makes their jobs interesting. The same can't be said for all civilian work legal or not, that's why you see civilians complaining so much.
 
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So ultimately all the greenzones have done is lower the interaction possibilities in these most popular locations, in turn lowering the amount of things to do and the potential RP to be had.

Don't get me wrong that by quoting only this I didn't read anything else, but like I said I want to move down to the core basics. "What is the problem this is intended to solve." If the only problem is having no violent interactions in these areas, that I feel like that was a worthy trade loss to combat the previous problems with centralized areas.

Yes crime is roleplay, but the violence was happening to such an extent that it stopped being roleplay and was just griefing because a lot of people will immediately go for the gun rather than expanding the roleplay. Trust me, it's not as simple as just saying "admin it" any more than it is admining the metagaming that currently goes on via the exploitation of green zone knowledge. A lot of rule violations go unreported and unless we physically saw what happened or have some other form of evidence, it's nigh impossible to just choose a side and advance beyond the warning.
 
Don't get me wrong that by quoting only this I didn't read anything else, but like I said I want to move down to the core basics. "What is the problem this is intended to solve." If the only problem is having no violent interactions in these areas, that I feel like that was a worthy trade loss to combat the previous problems with centralized areas.

Yes crime is roleplay, but the violence was happening to such an extent that it stopped being roleplay and was just griefing because a lot of people will immediately go for the gun rather than expanding the roleplay. Trust me, it's not as simple as just saying "admin it" any more than it is admining the metagaming that currently goes on via the exploitation of green zone knowledge. A lot of rule violations go unreported and unless we physically saw what happened or have some other form of evidence, it's nigh impossible to just choose a side and advance beyond the warning.

I have to wholeheartedly disagree with you, I've been on the lawful side of the server, the criminal side of the server and back to lawful side as a civilian. 90% of the common day to day roleplay that I have seen on this server involves violence in some way, shape or form. Even the events with the exception of the racing events (Which still have security and still get violent occasionally) are all based around violence of some kind. To make the argument that allowing criminal roleplay is not good enough to lift the greenzones is a flat out false statement. No offense, but it just is. This is GTA roleplay, this is not Hello Kitty Island Roleplay, it's not Harry Potter Roleplay, I get these are sarcastic examples but I don't really have good alternate examples.

You are trying to push the concept that GTA roleplay is not majorly based around violence or crimes and it simply isn't true, for any GTA roleplay server at all.
 
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I have to wholeheartedly disagree with you, I've been on the lawful side of the server, the criminal side of the server and back to lawful side as a civilian. 90% of the common day to day roleplay that I have seen on this server involves violence in some way, shape or form. Even the events with the exception of the racing events (Which still have security and still get violent occasionally) are all based around violence of some kind. To make the argument that allowing criminal roleplay is not good enough to lift the greenzones is a flat out false statement. No offense, but it just is. This is GTA roleplay, this is not Hello Kitty Island Roleplay, it's not Harry Potter Roleplay, I get these are sarcastic examples but I don't really have good alternate examples.

You are trying to push the concept that GTA roleplay is not majorly based around violence or crimes and it simply isn't true, for any GTA roleplay server at all.

Just because GTA isn’t a fun cute simulator doesn’t mean we have to base our server around stupid violence.

Also I’d like to re-state what RDK said : If the only problem is having no violent interactions in these areas, then I feel like that was a worthy trade loss to combat the previous problems with centralized areas.
 
I mean it seems like the community the has chosen to get involved with this discussion wants something like this to at least be tried, while the admins whom have joined the discussion do not. Why not have a community vote about it to get a bigger picture view?
 
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