Counter-Strike Not Planned Prohibit pursuing vents from the armory at the start of the round

[Nekkk]

So basically, I've seen a ton of times the CT's pursuing the vents from armory at the start of the round. I remember some admins told me it was not allowed and some say the opposite...
It would be great if the CT's are prohibited from doing this. That would be more RP and more fun.

Maybe it's in the rules I don't really remember to be honest

 

[Mooshua]

The general understanding is that CTs need to have reasonable suspicion that vents are open, such as hearing them break.
If they're pursuing before they have suspicion, then that is a problem.
(I do believe this is in the rules but I could be mistaken.)

 

[Nouille Chinoise]

I'll rarely agree with Nekkk, since he is my viceral enemy, but I'll have to concur with his opinion on that.

Coming from 15 years of JB, this is the only server I've seen it on. Kind of kills the vibe of rebelling.

Ex: In VIP, it's absolutely impossible to use cell armory vent since it's considered a KOS cell.

 

[Nekkk]

The general understanding is that CTs need to have reasonable suspicion that vents are open, such as hearing them break.
If they're pursuing before they have suspicion, then that is a problem.
(I do believe this is in the rules but I could be mistaken.)

Well, I was thinking about jb_undertale for example where the CT's can pursue the vents from armory when they hear the in-cell vent being broken. And so it kills the fun to have the vent cell basically...

 

[Nekkk]

I'll rarely agree with Nekkk, since he is my viceral enemy, but I'll have to concur with his opinion on that.

Coming from 15 years of JB, this is the only server I've seen it on. Kind of kills the vibe of rebelling.

Ex: In VIP, it's absolutely impossible to use cell armory vent since it's considered a KOS cell.

VIP in-cell vent is clearly something debatable. I trully think the CT's in front the window or in front the armory door are somehow camping the vent destination and so it's just unfun...

 

[BoyPhoenix]

The general understanding is that CTs need to have reasonable suspicion that vents are open, such as hearing them break.
If they're pursuing before they have suspicion, then that is a problem.
(I do believe this is in the rules but I could be mistaken.)

Yes it is.
Guards

As a guard, you must NOT ...

• damage vents or go into them unless you hear/see/suspect a prisoner has gone through (do not camp vents).

Now, if you really think about the special cases where you have in-cell vents like Undertale or SpyvsSpy, not pursuing vents when you hear them break can lead to CT losing the round pretty easily as they lead to armory, not a big fan too but you must take that into consideration

 

[Nouille Chinoise]

Yes it is.
Guards

As a guard, you must NOT ...

• damage vents or go into them unless you hear/see/suspect a prisoner has gone through (do not camp vents).

Now, if you really think about the special cases where you have in-cell vents like Undertale or SpyvsSpy, not pursuing vents when you hear them break can lead to CT losing the round pretty easily as they lead to armory, not a big fan too but you must take that into consideration

I think CTS should never break vents even if heard. They should persue at least from the entry point. Wouldn't that make sense?

 

[Nouille Chinoise]

They shouldn't be breaking the vent just to pursue, they must pursue from the entry point, if you see a CT breaking a vent to pursue rebellers even if he has reasonable suspicion report them to admin chat.

This should be clarified because 100% of the CTS we see persuing are persuing FROM armory TO cells.

 

[Nouille Chinoise]

In maps like Spy vs Spy where you don't need to break a vent to pursue, instead just walk that hallway, you are able to pursue from there, in the cases where you must break a vent to pursue someone inside a vent, you must go to the entry point to enter the vents

Sorry, but in Sky vs Sky you have to break the vent.

At least since the last update

 

[BoyPhoenix]

Sorry, but in Sky vs Sky you have to break the vent.

At least since the last update

I am sorry i was wrong about going through entry point, it was my mistake.

They can break any vent to pursue vents ONLY if they have reasonable suspicion, if you believe someone pursued without proper suspicion please report to admin chat.

You can read this thread: https://www.edgegamers.com/threads/375457/ for more info, specifically santa's answer.

If you want a more detailed answer about the rule (as mine may have confused you) please contact an Admin Trainer in eGO discord.

 

[4g0tt3nSou1]

+1, while protections exists, I think CTs should pursue from the Opened vent, rather than just busting through armory's and so on. Gives the CTs a challenge

 

[MS]

JB is already T sided as it is. I don't think they need even more help with rebelling.

You have other options when in the vent. On undertale you could escape through disco, hide in the vent for a while, wait around a corner to try and knife a CT, or take your chances and bum rush for armory.

On spy v spy you can grab the shotgun and go back to your cell, rush outside, or rush for armory.

This is map dependent and you should weigh your options instead of just vrooming for armory and complaining that CTs kill you.
Vents aren't a free rebel, they aren't a free path for armory; they are a risk that you take.
Big -1. Learn your maps.

 

[zach]

Well, I was thinking about jb_undertale for example where the CT's can pursue the vents from armory when they hear the in-cell vent being broken. And so it kills the fun to have the vent cell basically...

Well actually they can't on jb_undertale. Undertales vents in armory are closed until cell doors are opened. So if a CT sees that vents are open, they can not go directly back into armory and wait for the vent to open, because this is camping armory. They should instead pursue the rebellers from a different way (like disco).

 

[sopheyy]

JB is already T sided as it is. I don't think they need even more help with rebelling.

You have other options when in the vent. On undertale you could escape through disco, hide in the vent for a while, wait around a corner to try and knife a CT, or take your chances and bum rush for armory.

On spy v spy you can grab the shotgun and go back to your cell, rush outside, or rush for armory.

This is map dependent and you should weigh your options instead of just vrooming for armory and complaining that CTs kill you.
Vents aren't a free rebel, they aren't a free path for armory; they are a risk that you take.
Big -1. Learn your maps.

slay queen

 

[4g0tt3nSou1]

JB is def not T sided. It is the most CT-sided thing ever.
You guys have GUNS. we have a bomb and maybe one dude with a gun.

All it literally takes is someone to say "I heard a vent", bust through the door from armory, and kill anything in there. The ONLY map I can see where it's not heavily CT favored is spy, because of how tight the corridor is, makes getting them sawnoff headshots easy.

But every other map, there is little reason other than poor skill why a CT can't slaughter any T in the vents

The ONLY thing that balances JB at all is the fact that CTs have more rules to follow.

The only way JB is T-sided at all is CT skill issue or unfair map design, which is sparse.

 

[Daddy Succ]

Definitely not something that will be changed. Most maps that CT's can pursue vents straight from armory are already extremely T sided. Nobody would play CT on spy vs spy if CTs could not pursue vents from armory, as they would be stomped every round (more than they already are).

 

[MS]

JB is def not T sided. It is the most CT-sided thing ever.
You guys have GUNS. we have a bomb and maybe one dude with a gun.

All it literally takes is someone to say "I heard a vent", bust through the door from armory, and kill anything in there. The ONLY map I can see where it's not heavily CT favored is spy, because of how tight the corridor is, makes getting them sawnoff headshots easy.

But every other map, there is little reason other than poor skill why a CT can't slaughter any T in the vents

The ONLY thing that balances JB at all is the fact that CTs have more rules to follow.

The only way JB is T-sided at all is CT skill issue or unfair map design, which is sparse.

We must be talking about some other JB.

I collected the statistics over a span of 2 months and it's very T sided.

Ts won 8716 rounds and CTs won 1541 rounds. (CTs won 15% of rounds).
Despite having a 1:3 ratio, the vast majority of maps have a < 1:3 T:CT deaths ratio. The weighted average shows that only 2.23 Ts die for every CT that dies. Furthermore, 68 of these maps had the T:CT death ratio in the T's favor, whereas only 3 maps had favor towards CTs. (jb_quad_v3_ego, jb_oasis_v2c, and jb_bigmt_b3).

JB played perfectly at best is balanced. It is significantly harder to play as CT than as T. There are fewer CTs with many more challenges. A single mistake on T side (usually) results in only you dying. A single mistake on CT side (usually) results in the whole team dying.

 

[Polar Bear]

JB is def not T sided. It is the most CT-sided thing ever.

JB as a whole is a horrible way to word this. The way "JB" is T or CT sided is based on the individual intentional map design (most are t sided) upon other factors, such as T's knowing secrets (most do or at least 5 of us will and that's all It takes for the round win)

You guys have GUNS. we have a bomb and maybe one dude with a gun.

One guy with a bomb or the one dude with a gun can kill the entire CT team, or just one guy, 1 ct dies we get the better gun easily because of numbers or a thousand other reasons and then the round is over.

All it literally takes is someone to say "I heard a vent", bust through the door from armory, and kill anything in there. The ONLY map I can see where it's not heavily CT favored is spy, because of how tight the corridor is, makes getting them sawnoff headshots easy

Its not hard to kill T's in vent on any map including spy. The reason T's die in vents is because of the pathing they take, or the decisions they make with a gun, trying to get straight to armory instead of the other 3+ locations you can exit from and get a gun that can melt the CTs like a MAC-10 or other SMGS that are commonly used in maps, or peaking with guns (like a sawed off on the spy vent) instead of making the CT(s) come to you where you can easily one tap them.
If you die in vents as a T its a skill issue not a CT sided map issue

The only way JB is T-sided at all is CT skill issue or unfair map design, which is sparse.

It's not unfair map design, its the intentional map design for how the map creator wanted the map to be played. Blaming "unfair" map design as a reason for making JB T sided is just wrong.

Anyways the main thing is usually a CT skill issue

I don't understand how you came to the conclusion that JB is ct sided or anyone could even if they only have 30 minutes of playtime, cts getting above 3 wins on a map is probably rarer then getting struck by lightning at this point (during hours where there is more then 10 people on)

 

[Nouille Chinoise]

We must be talking about some other JB.

I collected the statistics over a span of 2 months and it's very T sided.

Ts won 8716 rounds and CTs won 1541 rounds. (CTs won 15% of rounds).
Despite having a 1:3 ratio, the vast majority of maps have a < 1:3 T:CT deaths ratio. The weighted average shows that only 2.23 Ts die for every CT that dies. Furthermore, 68 of these maps had the T:CT death ratio in the T's favor, whereas only 3 maps had favor towards CTs. (jb_quad_v3_ego, jb_oasis_v2c, and jb_bigmt_b3).

JB played perfectly at best is balanced. It is significantly harder to play as CT than as T. There are fewer CTs with many more challenges. A single mistake on T side (usually) results in only you dying. A single mistake on CT side (usually) results in the whole team dying.

Are you taking into consideration that 30% of the round end by default and are ALWAYS T wins?

Plus might/early Day. Rounds are 1 minute long and ALWAYS T wins aswell?

 

[MS]

Are you taking into consideration that 30% of the round end by default and are ALWAYS T wins?

Plus might/early Day. Rounds are 1 minute long and ALWAYS T wins aswell?

What stat are you claiming that 30% of rounds end by default? Would not a round going to time be at fault of the warden, and thus be a CT loss?

Rounds that are 1 minute don’t happen too often, only during late night/early morning when there are < 4 players online. I would call them statistically insignificant.

Removing rounds where there were less than 4 CTs results in 5092 rounds won by Ts and 989 by CTs (giving us a 16% win percentage).