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You have already made a more logical choice for a TF 2 update in 5 minutes on a forum than Valve has thought up in 5 months. They should ask you for help.
Medic supposedly going to be nerfed?
- Thread starter KuNai
- Start date
You have already made a more logical choice for a TF 2 update in 5 minutes on a forum than Valve has thought up in 5 months. They should ask you for help.
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- Jun 15, 2009
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I have some ideas on how they can change the Blutsauger or Needlegun.
Idea 1) +3HP on hit, No health regeneration
Idea 2) +3HP on hit, shoots further than normal needle gun (up to middle range it would shoot straight and then it would fall down), lose 5hp per second while you have it out.
Idea 3) +5HP on hit, -50HP
These tweaks would reward a medic's bravery but would remind him that he is not a combat class. My personal favorite is number 2. The blutsauger would have a longer range than the needlegun but it would constantly penalize you for using it by draining your health. This idea is similar to Guild Wars' Vampiric Weapon modifier. You lose health while you use a weapon but gain health on hits.
Now some of you might hate idea 3 but give it some thought before you trash it. As it stands the Blutsauger fires 10 shots a second. If all of those hit you will gain 30hp per second and 120hp in a full clip of 40 shots.
Now if you had 50 less health you would only have 100hp max, but would be able to get 50 health a second and 200 in a full clip. You would be a hard dude to put away in a battle and would only really be able to be taken out with spike damage, such as an explosion or a FAN doubleshot. On paper it doesn't look appealing but in action I would say it's a fair trade.
The idea behind these nerfs are to make the needlegun and bone saw appealing again. As it currently stands neither is a logical choice if you want to survive. The blutsauger is an upgrade as is the ubersaw. The idea between all unlock weapons is that they are to be SIDEgrades. Neither stronger nor weaker in action, but rather an alternate choice.
I haven't thought of anything for the Ubersaw but simple fixes would be lessening the rate you earn ubercharge via medigun. Making your ubercharges last half as long but fill a little faster while giving you a health boost. Or maybe even give it the ability to transplant an uber into a teammate. (Forcing your ubercharge by alternate fire on a teammate with the ubersaw) at the cost of health.
Idea 1) +3HP on hit, No health regeneration
Idea 2) +3HP on hit, shoots further than normal needle gun (up to middle range it would shoot straight and then it would fall down), lose 5hp per second while you have it out.
Idea 3) +5HP on hit, -50HP
These tweaks would reward a medic's bravery but would remind him that he is not a combat class. My personal favorite is number 2. The blutsauger would have a longer range than the needlegun but it would constantly penalize you for using it by draining your health. This idea is similar to Guild Wars' Vampiric Weapon modifier. You lose health while you use a weapon but gain health on hits.
Now some of you might hate idea 3 but give it some thought before you trash it. As it stands the Blutsauger fires 10 shots a second. If all of those hit you will gain 30hp per second and 120hp in a full clip of 40 shots.
Now if you had 50 less health you would only have 100hp max, but would be able to get 50 health a second and 200 in a full clip. You would be a hard dude to put away in a battle and would only really be able to be taken out with spike damage, such as an explosion or a FAN doubleshot. On paper it doesn't look appealing but in action I would say it's a fair trade.
The idea behind these nerfs are to make the needlegun and bone saw appealing again. As it currently stands neither is a logical choice if you want to survive. The blutsauger is an upgrade as is the ubersaw. The idea between all unlock weapons is that they are to be SIDEgrades. Neither stronger nor weaker in action, but rather an alternate choice.
I haven't thought of anything for the Ubersaw but simple fixes would be lessening the rate you earn ubercharge via medigun. Making your ubercharges last half as long but fill a little faster while giving you a health boost. Or maybe even give it the ability to transplant an uber into a teammate. (Forcing your ubercharge by alternate fire on a teammate with the ubersaw) at the cost of health.
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- Jun 25, 2009
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Doesn't anybody notice how stupid lowering blutsauger damage is?
Think about it..... for simplicity's sake, let's say the blut does 10 damage per bullet, and I have 100 health, he gets 3 health per bullet.
It takes him 10 shots to kill me, he gets 30 health.
Now, let's lower the blut damage to 5 damage per bullet
It takes him 20 shots, I get 60 health, twice what I would have gotten
The Ubersaw right now is flat-out overpowered, 25% of an uber can swing the tide of any game.
Think about it..... for simplicity's sake, let's say the blut does 10 damage per bullet, and I have 100 health, he gets 3 health per bullet.
It takes him 10 shots to kill me, he gets 30 health.
Now, let's lower the blut damage to 5 damage per bullet
It takes him 20 shots, I get 60 health, twice what I would have gotten
The Ubersaw right now is flat-out overpowered, 25% of an uber can swing the tide of any game.
someone rang?
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"Comments withheld per eGO policy."
What.
What.
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I'm glad the idea got junked, I would cry as it would ruin my 2nd most played class.
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I think people misunderstand the situation. It's not that the medic is overpowered, it's more an issue that there isn't enough variation from players playing the medic. Every medic you see is Blutsauger/Ubersaw. There are no Needlegun using Medics or Bonesaw medics. The only difference you'll see is between the Kritzkrieg and Medigun and you usually end up seeing the Medigun more often than Kritz.
Valve wants these weapons to be equally powerful and players decide how they want to use them. Look at the choices for other classes, Ambassador vs Revolver, Baseball Bat vs Sandman, Sandvitch vs Shotgun, each updated class has choices that dictate how you play the game. You can be equally effective either way.
I believe the Medic needs something to mix up the variation of players you see. Either the Blutsauger and Ubersaw need to be nerfed or the Bonesaw and Medigun need buffs. I think nerfing those weapons would be better than buffing the others. You would risk overpowering the class combat-wise. They would be stronger than nessessary for a class that is supposed to be focused on healing instead of combat. It's a tough decision and it requires a soft touch on Valve's part.
Valve wants these weapons to be equally powerful and players decide how they want to use them. Look at the choices for other classes, Ambassador vs Revolver, Baseball Bat vs Sandman, Sandvitch vs Shotgun, each updated class has choices that dictate how you play the game. You can be equally effective either way.
I believe the Medic needs something to mix up the variation of players you see. Either the Blutsauger and Ubersaw need to be nerfed or the Bonesaw and Medigun need buffs. I think nerfing those weapons would be better than buffing the others. You would risk overpowering the class combat-wise. They would be stronger than nessessary for a class that is supposed to be focused on healing instead of combat. It's a tough decision and it requires a soft touch on Valve's part.
All right, I'm going to quote myself again because I think everyone missed this:
In other words, the unlockables aren't getting a nerf, the original weapons are getting a buff. However, the buff messages won't show up in the original weapons, they'll simply show up as nerfs in the unlockables to maintain the pattern of not attaching attributes to vanilla weapons.
In other words, the unlockables aren't getting a nerf, the original weapons are getting a buff. However, the buff messages won't show up in the original weapons, they'll simply show up as nerfs in the unlockables to maintain the pattern of not attaching attributes to vanilla weapons.
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Dude the medic is absolutly fine too me and many other people it seems pointless
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Come on Valve, if it ain't broke don't fix it. Medic is fine just as it is.
This makes me a very sad panda. I pretty much only play medic (with the exception of soldier occasionally). No one is complaining about the ubersaw or blutauger all that much. Its not like medics are dominating games with them... if they get VIP its solely because they were great healers (or healing the right people) not because they went on a rampage with their other weapons.
So the moral of the story is, leave medic alone since the class if perfectly fine. Nerfing them isn't going to make people want to play the class more.
So the moral of the story is, leave medic alone since the class if perfectly fine. Nerfing them isn't going to make people want to play the class more.
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There are two general schools of medic.
The Battle Medic vs the Support Medic.
Why not alter one set of weapons to bolster this different roles?
The Blut and Ubersaw are fine as is. Its the regular weapons that need a buff. We don't need damage alterations or drops in health or anything like that. What the original weapons need is a regen bonus.
Taken from TF2Wiki - "When damaged, the Medic will regenerate 1 health per second. Unless the Medic is damaged again, after 5 seconds his regeneration rate increases to 2 health per second. After 10 seconds, it increases one more time to 3 health per second. If at any time the Medic takes damage, it starts the timer over and reverts to 1 health per second."
Why not give an additional regen bonus to the medic?
The bonesaw and syringe gun can each bolster the medic to give it an additional +3hp/sec bonus. At that rate, the medic can have a maximum of +9hp/second after certain criteria are met. This can promote the support medic. The one that follows around teammates keeping them alive and constantly healing. Since the support medic will hardly use the bonesaw and syringe unless in absolute dire circumstances.
This allows ubersaw and blut medics to be more combat oriented while still keeping a level of survival (and annoyance) but they must fight for their bonuses.
Thoughts?
The Battle Medic vs the Support Medic.
Why not alter one set of weapons to bolster this different roles?
The Blut and Ubersaw are fine as is. Its the regular weapons that need a buff. We don't need damage alterations or drops in health or anything like that. What the original weapons need is a regen bonus.
Taken from TF2Wiki - "When damaged, the Medic will regenerate 1 health per second. Unless the Medic is damaged again, after 5 seconds his regeneration rate increases to 2 health per second. After 10 seconds, it increases one more time to 3 health per second. If at any time the Medic takes damage, it starts the timer over and reverts to 1 health per second."
Why not give an additional regen bonus to the medic?
The bonesaw and syringe gun can each bolster the medic to give it an additional +3hp/sec bonus. At that rate, the medic can have a maximum of +9hp/second after certain criteria are met. This can promote the support medic. The one that follows around teammates keeping them alive and constantly healing. Since the support medic will hardly use the bonesaw and syringe unless in absolute dire circumstances.
This allows ubersaw and blut medics to be more combat oriented while still keeping a level of survival (and annoyance) but they must fight for their bonuses.
Thoughts?
i dont mind the bluntsager beta 2 that much since it'll still be my Anti-pyro gun.
However these nerfs are just ridiculous.
We are talking about a class that no one plays as, the few true medics, like myself and plenty of others in eGO. I cant speak for them.
But were made to heal and use those wepons as self-defense guns and last ditch options.
The feeling of them basicly making them unusable in last ditch situations just grinds my gears.
and i get why, they're trying to make it so people like Randall Flag cant play the "battle medic" Role. (no offense randall, i personally find it awsome you can do what you can w/ the bluntsager and ubersaw) But nethertheless i get it what they're doing.
I'm not fine w/ it. But i can understand why.
Responce to foxhound: that'd probably work better, however i dont think they've made any Big changes to the normal wepons besides the early dmg modifiers and the ammo/clip. So i dont think they'd do it.
But what i just hate about this is the fact i'm getting nerfed, however the (in my opinion) still overpowered demos can kill you w/ 1 very high chance crit grenade. THAT is something that could be changed, but nope time to pick on the Medic now.
</3 valve.
However these nerfs are just ridiculous.
We are talking about a class that no one plays as, the few true medics, like myself and plenty of others in eGO. I cant speak for them.
But were made to heal and use those wepons as self-defense guns and last ditch options.
The feeling of them basicly making them unusable in last ditch situations just grinds my gears.
and i get why, they're trying to make it so people like Randall Flag cant play the "battle medic" Role. (no offense randall, i personally find it awsome you can do what you can w/ the bluntsager and ubersaw) But nethertheless i get it what they're doing.
I'm not fine w/ it. But i can understand why.
Responce to foxhound: that'd probably work better, however i dont think they've made any Big changes to the normal wepons besides the early dmg modifiers and the ammo/clip. So i dont think they'd do it.
But what i just hate about this is the fact i'm getting nerfed, however the (in my opinion) still overpowered demos can kill you w/ 1 very high chance crit grenade. THAT is something that could be changed, but nope time to pick on the Medic now.
</3 valve.
