32nm Processors

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necavi

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Hello, I am working on building a new computer (very overpowered, in the hopes that it will remain able to play games into the far future) and have been hearing that I should wait for the 32nm CPU's, what do you guys think of this? Should I go for a less powerful upgrade now, or wait? (I currently am using a 5 year old laptop with 1GB of ram, and a 2.4ghz single-core processor)
 
I think you will get more performance for your dollar by buying a fast quad-core and paying lots for a pair of vid cards. Lots of ram and maybe a solid-state HDD. Video cards from GForce include a Physics GPU,and make a greater difference than the latest and fastest processor. The cost of the latest cpu won't be worth those same dollars spent on video cards. Buy the best mainboard you can find, with room for sli and lots of ram, you'll be set for few years.
 
my current ideas are about a quadcore processor, 12GB of ram (4x3GB), likely dual graphics cards, not sure precisely which ones, a 32GB SSD for my system, and an 8TB raid 60 for storage (8 2TB drives)
 
Intel's 32nm Westmere processor family using Clarkdale, Arrandale, and high-end Gulftown cores were demoed Febuary of this year. They come with an integrated graphics controller as well! However, as with all new tech, it will be a while before you see a stable chip hit the shelves. You will also have to wait for graphics and motherboard manufactures to step up to the plate as well (new GFX controllers and memory controllers, etc.). It's been several months and you STILL can't buy one! Basically, don't hold your breath. (est. Mid 2010 to get in line for a $1,000+ dual-core)

If you'd post or PM me a price range, I'd be more than happy to build you a dream-machine. It's part of what I do for a living. ;)

EDIT: Overpowered in my world comes AFTER 16-core machines with 16Gb+ of mem. Think about it... ;)
 
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necavi said:
my current ideas are about a quadcore processor, 12GB of ram (4x3GB), likely dual graphics cards, not sure precisely which ones, a 32GB SSD for my system, and an 8TB raid 60 for storage (8 2TB drives)
Click to expand...

Get a quad-core (recommending intel for this one i7 of course), you don't need 12gb of ram unless your doing heavy video editing and stuff (i recommend like 6gb) and yea for a solid state drive (get like around 60gb).......for graphics cards, i recommend the new ATI 5970 if your hardcore or a 5870/5850.......kinda need a budget though and you shoulda put this in Tech Talk forum instead.
 
I plan on upgrading my system to an Core i9, 5970, 12Gb DDR3 Ram, and 1000w PSU. Overkill no, not with the upgrades Aion is coming out with to the CryEngine 2. (Core i7 @ 3.6; 4870, 6Gb DDR3, 700W PSU current specs)

Now I know that'll run me 1200+$ but college loans are here for a reason. Excess checks are the win. Why pay'em back when you could get a machine that could kill people? XD

Also the i9 will have the same TDP as the i7 which means my ASUS P6T will be able to handle it and also use the same power as an i7 so the same heat output as well as power consumption for 50% more processing power.
 
Rogue Sniper said:
I plan on upgrading my system to an Core i9, 5970, 12Gb DDR3 Ram, and 1000w PSU. Overkill no, not with the upgrades Aion is coming out with to the CryEngine 2. (Core i7 @ 3.6; 4870, 6Gb DDR3, 700W PSU current specs)

Now I know that'll run me 1200+$ but college loans are here for a reason. Excess checks are the win. Why pay'em back when you could get a machine that could kill people? XD

Also the i9 will have the same TDP as the i7 which means my ASUS P6T will be able to handle it and also use the same power as an i7 so the same heat output as well as power consumption for 50% more processing power.
Click to expand...

To clarify....using the i9's on-board GFX controller will take some help from MoBo manufactures everywhere.

Will it fit? Yes.

Will it work? Yes.

Will it use ALL of it's capacity without new boards to support it? Emphatic NO!

In short, the i9 WILL work with current tech. However, as with ALL new tech, it's the proverbial cart-before-the-horse. I TRULY recommend waiting until 3rd or 4th quarter 2010 before stepping into the i9 class. Even Intel's not putting all their eggs in one basket until Q4 of 2010. (Final manufacture plant upgrade q4 2010.)

I'll never talk you outta spending $$ if you want to, but if you do....give me a call/PM! I'd MUCH rather learn from your $1,000+ mistake than cost my customers money on un-tested (in the field) new tech. ;)
 
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/270605-28-intel-core-benched-cores-pure

Reports that current BIOS upgrades have had trouble with the unreleased processor, however will run fine on current boards with future BIOS releases.

Also all I want from it is A) the performance gain of 2 more cores and 2 more threads; B) the usefulness of 12 threads when compiling maps for Source Engine games; C) Being able to OC to 3.6Ghz (Current for my i7 920 with my aftermarket HS); D) bragging rights.

So all the additional features of integrated graphics controller and such that has no use for me, I could care less about it not working as long as I get my performance gain, thats why I want it. With a i9 and a 5970 as well as 12Gb DDR3 1333Mhz RAM, Ill be able to keep the system for 2 - 3 years thus saving me money in the end game. As before I would upgrade every year to keep up with games, though with this system a better GPU would help, I also want more speed :D.

In addition, I do have connections to buy directly from the Intel store, you know the ones for employees only? Yeah my RA has 4 family members that work there, so I can get it from there for cheaper than Newegg.
 
Rogue Sniper said:
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/270605-28-intel-core-benched-cores-pure

Reports that current BIOS upgrades have had trouble with the unreleased processor, however will run fine on current boards with future BIOS releases.

Also all I want from it is A) the performance gain of 2 more cores and 2 more threads; B) the usefulness of 12 threads when compiling maps for Source Engine games; C) Being able to OC to 3.6Ghz (Current for my i7 920 with my aftermarket HS); D) bragging rights.

So all the additional features of integrated graphics controller and such that has no use for me, I could care less about it not working as long as I get my performance gain, thats why I want it. With a i9 and a 5970 as well as 12Gb DDR3 1333Mhz RAM, Ill be able to keep the system for 2 - 3 years thus saving me money in the end game. As before I would upgrade every year to keep up with games, though with this system a better GPU would help, I also want more speed :D.

In addition, I do have connections to buy directly from the Intel store, you know the ones for employees only? Yeah my RA has 4 family members that work there, so I can get it from there for cheaper than Newegg.
Click to expand...

It's impossible to argue with that logic! However, are you assuming that the Gulftown core is a direct upgrade? I was quoting reseller prices for the Clarkdale (Desktop) and Arrandale (mobile) cores. The Gulftown core proc (6-core Extreme Series) will retail over $2,300 with a 15% mark-up from retailers. Well, that's what I was quoted from dist. earlier this year.

I have been known to be wrong and welcome input!!

For necavi: Machine build in process, should be at revision 1 and posted soon!
 
necavi said:
Heh, awesome, thank you
Click to expand...


i7, Overlock it to 4ghz
get an x58 chipset EVGA(Lifetime Warranty)
i would only do 6ghz of some really good ram that you can tighten up the timings on, alot of people never tighten their timings and run crap @ 5-5-5-15 2t and they never get the most from their ram
HDD: Intel X25 SSD 300gb Primary
Secondary drive = 1TB Caviar or whatever, if even needed, or a couple raptors, or even make it like 2-3 SSD's if you can

If you built that you could run everything you throw at it for 4-5 years and all you would have to do is possible upgrade the video card.

Wait for the new Fermi from NVidiaGeForce if you can.

What box are you coming from ?
 
Angellas said:
It's impossible to argue with that logic! However, are you assuming that the Gulftown core is a direct upgrade? I was quoting reseller prices for the Clarkdale (Desktop) and Arrandale (mobile) cores. The Gulftown core proc (6-core Extreme Series) will retail over $2,300 with a 15% mark-up from retailers. Well, that's what I was quoted from dist. earlier this year.

I have been known to be wrong and welcome input!!

For necavi: Machine build in process, should be at revision 1 and posted soon!
Click to expand...

Many reports show it wont be higher than $1,000USD. Primarily for the fact Intel wants people and lots of people to buy them. More people that buy, the more that OC to show everyone that Intel has faster, more powerful CPUs. This is the same for AMD. Both companies want to say they're the best, granted it also depends on what best means with 1000's of programs out there that use the CPU differently.

The Gulftown core

Like Conroe (Core 2 Duo 65 nm) and Penryn (Core 2 Duo 45 nm), Gulftown has a whole lot in common with Bloomfield. In short, we can say that the Bloomfield has been given two cores and some third-level cache love. The capacity ratio of the L3 cache to the number of cores remains the same: Bloomfield has 4 cores and 8 MB of L3, Gulftown has 6 cores and 12MB of L3. The L1D, L1C and L2 cache capacity remains unchanged. Also unchanged is the processor's ?make-up? - in addition to six cores in a single block of silicon there is a block of L3 cache, a triple-channel memory controller and two QPI links. One of them is used to communicate with the IOH system and with the rest of the system (X58 desktop chipset or 5520 server chipset). The other one is used for communication with the second processor on dual-processor machines, and it will be disabled in the desktop and workstation version (similar to Core i7-900 and Xeon W35x0). Intel has not yet shown a silicon wafer with the Gulftown cores or the processor itself with the core uncovered. According to unofficial sources, its size should be approximately 21.1 ? 11.4 mm. The core surface area is probably around 240 mm2, i.e. about 10% less than the Bloomfield core (263 mm 2).


This means that if the yield on Intel's 32-nanometer process technology is as good as that on 45-nanometer technology, the manufacturing cost of a single Gulftown is less than that of a Bloomfield. But let us not count on Intel's six core price tag to be low. Firstly, Intel's throughput in the 45-nanometer process is much higher ? only one plant (D1D in Oregon) is ready to produce 32 nm circuits. Another three are being converted. Meanwhile, 45-nm systems are produced in three facilities. In addition, the Gulftown prices will be tailored to their target consumers ? prepare to spend about 1,000-1,200 dollars for the desktop version. We still do not know what commercial name the Gulftowns will be given ? various sources report it to be i9 Core or Core i7-1000 series.
Click to expand...

- http://pclab.pl/art39718.html

The problem is supply, one plant (Oregon where my RA's family works) is the only one ready for 32nm production and three more being converted. So 1000 - 1200 seems right, though it depends on what the speeds will be. i7 920 was the best because it was the same chip as the other two models. Thus all were over clockable to 4.0Ghz though the Extreme did have a 6.4QT/s (Oh damn cause the i7 wasn't beastly enough). In addition to being 275$ at the time (Summer 09) vs the 1000$ model that was 3.33Ghz, however I do see why people still bought that in case they were confident enough to build their rigs but not OC them.
 
Rogue Sniper said:
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/270605-28-intel-core-benched-cores-pure

Reports that current BIOS upgrades have had trouble with the unreleased processor, however will run fine on current boards with future BIOS releases.

Also all I want from it is A) the performance gain of 2 more cores and 2 more threads; B) the usefulness of 12 threads when compiling maps for Source Engine games; C) Being able to OC to 3.6Ghz (Current for my i7 920 with my aftermarket HS); D) bragging rights.

So all the additional features of integrated graphics controller and such that has no use for me, I could care less about it not working as long as I get my performance gain, thats why I want it. With a i9 and a 5970 as well as 12Gb DDR3 1333Mhz RAM, Ill be able to keep the system for 2 - 3 years thus saving me money in the end game. As before I would upgrade every year to keep up with games, though with this system a better GPU would help, I also want more speed :D.

In addition, I do have connections to buy directly from the Intel store, you know the ones for employees only? Yeah my RA has 4 family members that work there, so I can get it from there for cheaper than Newegg.
Click to expand...

Don't lie rogue, you upgrade every year because you like upgrades, not because you need it to maxx out games.. hehe.. only game you even need an i7 for to maxx is Gta IV @ like 1920x1200 + reso.
 
Actually I really want the i9 for Source Map compiling. Core 2 Duo e8400 @ 3.0Ghz - 10 minutes; Core i7 920 @ 3.6Ghz - 2 minutes; Core i9 @ 3.6Ghz hopefully - < 1 minute. (Map was ba_jail_devs_v1b3) Personally I hate waiting for maps to compile to find out "PORTAL FLOW ERROR !!! LEAKED !!! " or whatever it says...

Plus if Aion moves to the CryEngine 2 then more reason for an i9 and 5970. Also it'll heat up my dorm room since my roommate likes it cold and I like it 75ish so its a win - win situation for me XD.
 
Rogue Sniper said:
Many reports show it wont be higher than $1,000USD. Primarily for the fact Intel wants people and lots of people to buy them. More people that buy, the more that OC to show everyone that Intel has faster, more powerful CPUs. This is the same for AMD. Both companies want to say they're the best, granted it also depends on what best means with 1000's of programs out there that use the CPU differently.



- http://pclab.pl/art39718.html

The problem is supply, one plant (Oregon where my RA's family works) is the only one ready for 32nm production and three more being converted. So 1000 - 1200 seems right, though it depends on what the speeds will be. i7 920 was the best because it was the same chip as the other two models. Thus all were over clockable to 4.0Ghz though the Extreme did have a 6.4QT/s (Oh damn cause the i7 wasn't beastly enough). In addition to being 275$ at the time (Summer 09) vs the 1000$ model that was 3.33Ghz, however I do see why people still bought that in case they were confident enough to build their rigs but not OC them.
Click to expand...

Thanks, bro, for the direct link! I'll have to speak with my rep about the reseller price!

I am aware, however, of the production limitations. The D1C plant in Oregon (very close to your RA's Oregon-based D1D plant) is scheduled for 32nm process upgrades as we speak (4q 2009). Their Fab 32 plant in Arizona and their Fab 11x plant in New Mexico aren't scheduled to upgrade until 2010.

I was under the assumption, however, that the Gulftown core would be the 'EE' (Extreme Edition) of the i9 family. I believe that I should do some more research before believing Intel employee's jive!! (Yeah, I know, they're selling me things...) ;)

Thanks for the info. I'll post-back when I have more definitive information.
 
Angellas said:
Thanks, bro, for the direct link! I'll have to speak with my rep about the reseller price!

I am aware, however, of the production limitations. The D1C plant in Oregon (very close to your RA's Oregon-based D1D plant) is scheduled for 32nm process upgrades as we speak (4q 2009). Their Fab 32 plant in Arizona and their Fab 11x plant in New Mexico aren't scheduled to upgrade until 2010.

I was under the assumption, however, that the Gulftown core would be the 'EE' (Extreme Edition) of the i9 family. I believe that I should do some more research before believing Intel employee's jive!! (Yeah, I know, they're selling me things...) ;)

Thanks for the info. I'll post-back when I have more definitive information.
Click to expand...

hey....that was my link that i posted within like the first 5 posts.........
Rogue, why don't you get your i7 920 to 4.0ghz?? get like a Prolimatech Megahalem and just get it to 4.0ghz so its an absolute beast. My Q6600 does 3.6ghz :P if i had water-cooling i could probably hit 4.0ghz but its not worth it for me.
ATI 5970 is epic....i hope to pick one up when the prices drop, will last me quite a while =)
 
PewPewBangBang said:
hey....that was my link that i posted within like the first 5 posts.........
Rogue, why don't you get your i7 920 to 4.0ghz?? get like a Prolimatech Megahalem and just get it to 4.0ghz so its an absolute beast. My Q6600 does 3.6ghz :P if i had water-cooling i could probably hit 4.0ghz but its not worth it for me.
ATI 5970 is epic....i hope to pick one up when the prices drop, will last me quite a while =)
Click to expand...

pew pew

what board are you running and what is your settings @ 3.6 ? I cannot get my q6600 to post @ 3.6 on my 680i a1.
 
PewPewBangBang said:
hey....that was my link that i posted within like the first 5 posts.........
Rogue, why don't you get your i7 920 to 4.0ghz?? get like a Prolimatech Megahalem and just get it to 4.0ghz so its an absolute beast. My Q6600 does 3.6ghz :P if i had water-cooling i could probably hit 4.0ghz but its not worth it for me.
ATI 5970 is epic....i hope to pick one up when the prices drop, will last me quite a while =)
Click to expand...

I have N520 Cooler Master heatsink that was 30$ on sale so I opted for that and left my 920 @ 3.6Ghz. I see plenty of performance gain from 2.66 to 3.6 than 3.6 to 4.0. Also my only goal for OC'ing was to push it 1Ghz over the stock speeds. If I wanted 4.0 I would have done it already, I knew it was capable but I need threads not speed for mapping. The speed is for gaming which runs all of my games fine (No I do play more than Source, Aion, such as CoD MW1/2, W@W, L4D/2, Far Cry 2, Fallout 3, Mass Effect, and others) Granted they do use multiple cores but not the threads per se as the Source Compiler for maps does.
 
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