Side effects of the new patch.

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Pyrotechnician

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Personally I don't think the nerf affected the demo that much but it's pretty obvious that hardly anyone uses the soldier anymore.

1. Spies are now even more useless than before. With the soldier and demo nerfed now everyone seems to like playing pyros. (soldier was the reason pyros were underpowered) Before the patch spies were useless against good players now they are useless against bad players too since there are always 20 pyros running around spraying their flame throwers nonstop.

2. Soldier's rocket spam and spies were the only things that kept good snipers from dominating games. Now with the number of soldiers and spies reduced snipers can almost snipe without fear. And this is bad news for heavies, moving around without cover now = certain death.

3. Soldiers are the main offensive class and they are the ones that break defenses and stalemates. With the soldier nerfed now more games are turning into campfests and stalemates.
 
I agree, and im happy because i play sniper most of the time :D
 
If anything it seems the update may hinder Valve's approach to encouraging the game to end in a win, rather than a stalemate. I find myself running back for ammo often with the demo, and soldiers face the same link to the nearest engineer or fallen weapons. The ammo limit seems to be a fair approach to nerfing the dominance that a single soldier or demo can hold, as they have to at least retreat for ammo once a minute during a heavy skirmish. I think it'll balance out to make the "Team" part of TF2 ever more crucial to a victory. We still don't have 2-stage soldier rockets to prevent gratuitous splash damage at close rage, so requiring the class to retreat is a balance to the soldier's dominance over close-range classes. The soldier will always remain the go-to class for noobs, and on the flip-side it will always remain the backbone of any team for very adept players. I look forward to more Valve updates as it refreshes the gameplay and makes us all think differently. Maybe, as a result of the influx of pyros, we'll see a group of spies who learn how to pwn pyros 9/10 times. I'm optimistic about any Valve patch, as they seem to be one of the most customer-centric corporations I have been glad to buy from.
 
Ever since the patch, offenses have been far less successful on Dustbowl. I don't see uber soldier rushes any more, so it's harder to get those sentries destroyed.
 
[quote1204708259=The Red Comet]
Ever since the patch, offenses have been far less successful on Dustbowl. I don't see uber soldier rushes any more, so it's harder to get those sentries destroyed.
[/quote1204708259]

exactly. it often takes 2-3 vollies of rockets to take out a single sentry now you can really afford to do that anymore. And demos can still camp next to dispensers and ammo and spam nonstop. Offense got nerfed and defense got buffed and that is just lame. It's espeically evident on dustbowl and 2fort. The teams almost never get past the first stage anymore.
 
[quote1204708372=Guardian-X]
Maybe, as a result of the influx of pyros, we'll see a group of spies who learn how to pwn pyros 9/10 times. I'm optimistic about any Valve patch, as they seem to be one of the most customer-centric corporations I have been glad to buy from.
[/quote1204708372]

I'm afraid that will never happen even with a spy buff. Even as a sniper I have like a 10:1 kd ratio against spies. Spies atm are the easiest kills in the game by far. and they are completely useless on offense at times. A single pyro dedicated to spy checking can easily negate the other team's spies all by himself.

As people get better at the game spies will only become more and more useless.
 
I've just found that I am less tempted to play rounds as a soldier... I'm not very accurate and need a load of ammo to kill anything!

I'll stick to frying people
 
I'm normally a sniper so I don't like spam... this change doesn't really bother me
 
The ironic thing about spies is that the better the pyros on the team, the easier time they should have. I don't know about other pyros, but I don't spend all my time standing next to and engineer randomly spychecking anyone who walks past for 25 minutes until the match ends. Pyros are an offensive class and I use them like that. If I see anyone acting overtly suspicious then I'll puff em, but often times I don't catch spies anyway simply because I tend to be the only pyro on my team and they just bypass my vision. Also, as a spy, it's a piece of cake to remove sentries if there aren't more than one covering each other. Get behind them (almost every time the engineer will be standing directly behind the sentry), stab, and sap before it can turn to whack you. Also, a spy doesn't have to hang around the enemy base for that long. If a spy isn't around long enough to get spotted, he won't fail at his mission. Lafinass said that, "If you expect your disguise to last through more than a passing glance, you fail as a spy." It's true. You can easily open up a hole in the defense, invis your way behind a group of a few heavymedics, backstab, and run away. Sure, there are fewer soldiers to stab, but personally I don't see an increase in pyro (if anything it's in engineer), and you really underestimate spies. Clearly you've never played a match with someone who actually does it the right way.

The ability of snipers to roam free is a good and bad thing in my perspective. I find myself getting headshotted more than before, but when I get behind them (and I do quite often) they're free axe kills basically.

Uber pyro breaks defenses if they're not really far away. Uber demo can take care of the rest.
 
Eh, it's not so bad. I played Soldier and a good one will have plenty of ammo from his fallen foes at his disposal. There's always little boxes and dispensers laying around too. Dispensers just got much more useful, which is great.
 
I don't mind the patch, I generally played as a Pyro anyways. More people play as Pyros now, but that doesn't make them any good at it. I also play as a spy, sometimes. Mostly when there is one sniper in particular who is bugging me.
 
I used to play a lot of DM type games where ammo was earned or found, not given at start like it is in TF2 - so for me, its not really a big deal. I can manage my inventory, I know where the ammo boxes are and I have a feel for the item respawn times now. I can run amok on gravelpit as Demo or Soldier with out having to go back to C. Keeping ammo out of your opponent's hands is just as crucial as killing them.
 
Well, I seem to do just fine killing things even after the patch. I've noticed no difference in playing spy; there are more pyros sure, but I put myself in the right position and kill them too.

Snipers, Pyros, Heavies, Moose, watch out! I'm coming for you! >=D
 
I don't play as solider or demo very much at all, so it doesn't affect me. As a heavy, Pyro, and even a spy I always said "oh crap! a demo/soldier". heavies will have an easier time with less explosives around. and the pyro and spy will run onto these guys less.
 
Halo, I love that I was the only one mentioned by name...has everyone in the clan come to hate me already? :D
 
At first I didn't like the nerf, mostly because I am a soldier (always have been), but I have come to realize that it really didn't make much of a difference. The only thing it did was keep less skilled players who just sat back and spammed rockets for two minutes strait from playing soldier all of the time. Now a lot of truly good soldiers are popping out, who only need 1-3 rockets to get a kill. This is a peice of cake. Now all you do is go and pick up their weapon and you are back to square one on ammo. I don't really play demo much, but to me it looks like the same principle with spamming. I think their intention here was to make use of the ammo that was implemented from picking up weapons. I haven't really noticed a change in the tempo of play, either. Just depends on the people in the game and how they play really. Sometimes you get stuck with a group of people who just like to sit back and defend. :)
 
[quote1204752296=Moose]
Halo, I love that I was the only one mentioned by name...has everyone in the clan come to hate me already? :D
[/quote1204752296]

But you know I love picking on you. ;)

Cya when I get home from school! >=D
 
The update doesnt really effect demomen, but it really hurts soldiers sometimes. I just dont see the need to nerf their ammo supply, of all things. If you wanna take away their crits, or something. I'd rather have no soldier crits than have their ammo taken away. I'm as big a soldier nub as anyone, and crit rockets are just so darned random. I dont like them.
 
Hmm imo, valve should havee made the rocket do a lot more damage to the soldier at close range rather than bring down the ammo so much. Since snipers were practically the only class who lost a lot of ammo(submachine guns have practicallly nothing), Valve should have just kept it that way. Demomen really did not need a nerf, honestly.
 
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