The blutsauger paradox

[firestrike24]

I've been thinking about this for a while, and finally decided to post it, it's about how the blutsauger seems to be immune to any damage nerfs or crit disadvantages.

For discussive purposes, we won't be discussing the differences between regeneration.

Think about it:

Let's say that I'm a medic and I need to heal up, for simplicity's sake, let's assume that the enemy has 100 health, and I deal 10 damage per hit, gaining 1 health each time, he's doing damage to me as well.

I would need to shoot 10 needles, this would give me 10 health.

If the blutsauger's damage was halved, then I would need to shoot twice as many needles, giving me 20 health.

If the blutsauger has crits, then I win anyway, I kill him in a matter of seconds (4 shots), I have no need to heal up.

 

[EffeKtioNz]

I dont know I mean I do like the Blutsauger but I think its to overpowered and something else should be done with it.

 

[PeZku]

O_O

Note to self...Stay away from Medics.

 

[EffeKtioNz]

O_O

Note to self...Stay away from Medics.

Thats about right.

 

[/Aqua Blue]

Shooting needles does not mean landing the needles. Unless you are shooting in a very long narrow hallway with no ceiling the person should be strafing and firing back at you.

Before 10 needles = Around 40 damage + 30 health + around 7 health from passive regen due to battle time.

However say we halved the damage, reduced the health gain, and removed passive regen.
20 needles = 40 damage + 20 health + 3 health.

Effectively cutting the effectiveness of the bluts. Be warned this only occurs if you hit ALL your needles which are very unlikely to happen.

 

[NCA]

Too much math, too little fun.

 

[? Frisky Dingo ?]

Here's an idea, attack the medic while his back is turned No need to worry about any needles.

 

[mrcool]

No one plays medic anyway so don't worry about it.

Go team snipers!

 

[Kamon]

Well, medics are supposed to be focused on healling allies. Their allies are their main weapons, and the blutsauger/syringe gun are used to ward approaching enemies away. Now, chances are, a weaker class such as Scout fighting a medic up close may want to back off while they flee--even though most medics are prone to backpedal while firing anyway, this is meant to make them a very sturdy class.

The classes that should focus on killing medics upfront are the primary charging classes--soldiers, heavies, demoman, and pyros. Most medics won't stop healing an opponent if one of these classes are attacking (though for pyro, they may), hoping their ally can finish the job with their boosted health.

Scouts, snipers, and spies are also good for terminating a medic without their awareness. Snipers don't need any explanation, the spies have their lethal backstab (and a surprise Ambassador-Shot-To-The-Face-While-Being-Healed doesn't hurt either), and the Scouts can get around medics to surprise them. A quick unloading of the FAN or a few close-range Scatter Gun shots can finish the job easily.

One cannot simply W+M1 into Mordor!

 

[TehLemur]

Well, medics are supposed to be focused on healling allies. Their allies are their main weapons, and the blutsauger/syringe gun are used to ward approaching enemies away. Now, chances are, a weaker class such as Scout fighting a medic up close may want to back off while they flee--even though most medics are prone to backpedal while firing anyway, this is meant to make them a very sturdy class.

The classes that should focus on killing medics upfront are the primary charging classes--soldiers, heavies, demoman, and pyros. Most medics won't stop healing an opponent if one of these classes are attacking (though for pyro, they may), hoping their ally can finish the job with their boosted health.

Scouts, snipers, and spies are also good for terminating a medic without their awareness. Snipers don't need any explanation, the spies have their lethal backstab (and a surprise Ambassador-Shot-To-The-Face-While-Being-Healed doesn't hurt either), and the Scouts can get around medics to surprise them. A quick unloading of the FAN or a few close-range Scatter Gun shots can finish the job easily.

One cannot simply W+M1 into Mordor!

But Kamon, we need to destroy the one hat to rule them all!

for the discussion, I think the medic is now better then before, he can handle himself a little more, and now focus more on healing instead of worrying about healing himself tons with the new regen rate.

 

[Kamon]

But Kamon, we need to destroy the one hat to rule them all!

for the discussion, I think the medic is now better then before, he can handle himself a little more, and now focus more on healing instead of worrying about healing himself tons with the new regen rate.

Well, the medic still heals faster with the medigun out. Maybe that'll help them focus on their allies rather than going suicide commando with a gun that shoots medcine.

 

[TehLemur]

Well, the medic still heals faster with the medigun out. Maybe that'll help them focus on their allies rather than going suicide commando with a gun that shoots medcine.

That's probably what Valve intended for this update to be about.

 

[iamevilbear]

No one plays medic anyway so don't worry about it.

Go team snipers!

this comment does not compute. i am evil medic

 

[mrcool]

this comment does not compute. i am evil medic

I didn't know CS:S had medics.

Maybe I should play it.

 

[DRaGZ]

You're not taking into account firing rates, reload rates, and the fact that needles are projectiles which are relatively easy to dodge.

A Blutsauger that shoots all 40 needles in three seconds is better than the current Blutsauger because the rate of damage and healing is much higher. If you lower the amount of damage you do or the amount of health you gain, you need to fire for that much longer in order to do the same amount of damage/health gain you did before, whereas two FAN shots will still kill you regardless.

Blutsauger or not, the Medic is still a very vulnerable class.

EDIT: Also, the Medic has a ramp-up limit similar to the Soldier and Demoman's explosives: it only goes up to 120% base damage while normal weapons go up to 150% base damage (Scattergun and FAN go up to a whopping 175%). This makes it less effective up close while other weapons are more powerful.

 

[Carmine]

Well, the medic still heals faster with the medigun out. Maybe that'll help them focus on their allies rather than going suicide commando with a gun that shoots medcine.

Actually it does not, if you have the blutsauger equipped but not out your regeneration rate is still lowered.

Blutsauger = Combat Medic who uses the needles alot

Syringe Gun = Regular medic or combat medic who ubersaws.

No math, no algorithms, just common sense.

 

[Kamon]

Actually it does not, if you have the blutsauger equipped but not out your regeneration rate is still lowered.

Blutsauger = Combat Medic who uses the needles alot

Syringe Gun = Regular medic or combat medic who ubersaws.

No math, no algorithms, just common sense.

oic, I was unaware. Thanks for pointing that out.

 

[opscomm]

No one plays medic anyway so don't worry about it.

Go team snipers!

Dont tell woodstock that. He'll find you in an alley and ubersaw you to death.

 

[Maverick.]

Or, you could use the Syringe Gun instead. Seeing as when you are healing a team mate you are getting healed 6hp/s and 4hp/s without healing.

 

[Sabion]

Needles are extremely easy to dodge...Unless you are in a hallway or vent, you can easily strafe out of the needles way and kill the medic before he can kill you...The most easy way to kill a medic is to avoid one way paths, strafe whenever possible and not run straight at a medic...