The Death of Jail and You!

[PhaseXero]

Jail is Not Fun
While I love eGO Jail I NEVER have played on a more strict jail, which of course is why we are popular. However, when we have death squads going around killing people for the slightest twitch or being slightly out of knifing distance this isn't fun and has got to stop.

The main purpose of jail is to be fun, period. This isn't a military POW camp where we need soften prisoners for interrogation. Be lenient, let small things go. Try to let as many people live as reasonably possible so they can get killed for real rebelling or failing at activities.

eGO Discrimination
Giving ST to your friends every round? Killing only pubbers? This has to stop, I have seen way too many pubbers come and go because they are killed every round during trivia, or they see only eGO members getting ST.

Give ST to those who deserve it, stop giving it to your friends. Stop giving ST to leadership when they come in, its kissing ass, everyone knows it, it's incredibly weak. Balance your killings between eGOs and pubbers.

Update: We need SOLUTIONS

Summarizing what has been said so far. We have problems with jail, we now all know that. We also know there have been many threads about this issue which have not been resolved.

We now need YOU to come up with ACTUAL SOLUTIONS. Things we can do to make things fun for both sides. This is mostly rule changes but we also need ways of changing behaviours as well.

I think we have covered all we need to say about problems, just use the search tool to find out what we are saying.

 

[FooFooKudleyPoops]

I agree with you phase. I have witnessed much of what you speak of and it would be nice if we could all (eGO members and pubs a like) work on these two things. I also believe it will make jail a more fun environment all around.

 

[JayFlip]

RE: Point 1

You can give guidelines to the T's on where to look, but also tell your guards to be lenient, or that only you may decide if a T is not following orders immediately after leaving the cell. For not moving, you may allow them to look around. However, this makes rebelling much more possible. Although, rebellions and the stopping of them are part of the fun!

RE: Point 2

You'll notice that it's said somewhere (I forget where, I've seen it around the forums) that a benefit to joining is that you're held in higher regard to pubs. However, I do know some pubs who haven't joined but frequent the servers who get ST quite often. I'm guilty of being somebody who gets ST for no reason, lots. When I get it a few days in a row, I begin to just follow the group around anyway.

On both these accounts, there are no rules against these. There are guidelines. For example, freekilled do not automatically get ST, but it seems reasonable that they do.
For allowing people to live during failure to follow orders, it shows that you aren't the strongest warden, and rebellions can be planned and carried out easier. But again, thats part of the game and fun.

Despite your points, they don't always happen, and they don't ruin the game. Jail is still fun.

 

[EyelessHunter]

You see it doesn't require all this explanation. Just follow this simple equation.

Jail=Jail

J=F

Substitute.

Jail=Fail

 

[Dakyn]

I think jail would be a lot more fun if we weren't so strict to the T's. I think letting them look around a little bit and give them a BIT more freedom would be good. But also, T's can't just keep rebelling because we are not being as strict anymore, cause that too would make it less fun. We have to find an equal balance.

 

[PhaseXero]

For allowing people to live during failure to follow orders, it shows that you aren't the strongest warden, and rebellions can be planned and carried out easier. But again, thats part of the game and fun.

I think you failed to grasp my point. I'm not talking about not punishing rebellers but about being more lenient about things that don't really matter such as twitching and being absolutely in knifing distance. People naturally twitch to look around. We are the ONLY jail server to enforce such severe rules and keep Ts facing the wall for extended periods of time.

You'll notice that it's said somewhere (I forget where, I've seen it around the forums) that a benefit to joining is that you're held in higher regard to pubs. However, I do know some pubs who haven't joined but frequent the servers who get ST quite often. I'm guilty of being somebody who gets ST for no reason, lots. When I get it a few days in a row, I begin to just follow the group around anyway.

I think you misunderstood the meaning. We are held in higher regards in upholding the rules and spirit of EdgeGamers, not to be treated preferentially better. We don't join so that we can have advantages over the pubs.

I think it is very bad public relations when our members time and time again are given preferential treatment. You yourself have just mentioned the exceptions to the rules. Why aren't random pubbers given random STs? People have cried out time and time again that this isn't fair.

Jail is fun for you because of the mentions you have mentioned in your chat. I rarely get picked anymore in trivia and I would say I live a lot more than I should.

This is why pubbers don't come back.

 

[JayFlip]

I have seen many pubbers come back.
Keep in mind that people choose their servers differently. Before eGO, there was only one server I had on my favourites. AzD 24/7. Other than that, every server, every map I went to was random.

I see you as warden quite often. Do you give random STs? (I'm not calling you out. I'm actually wondering).

Most times I kill for "no looking around", it's not a twitch of the head. It's a full on look-around.
As for twitching, allow them to twitch. Tell your guards to do this.
Yes, I know this means that you would have to be warden for this to be allowed. But, since you have brought up the topic, hopefully everybody else will read this thread and follow suit.

 

[bandgeek]

and that is why i never give out ST's. i saw this other day to some G i will not say who. he was getting ST everyround for like 5 straight rounds for no appareant reason. and the leniant thing. i always kill a T if they even move their mouse i wont do that anymore.

 

[Ruthless]

You see it doesn't require all this explanation. Just follow this simple equation.

Jail=Jail

J=F

Substitute.

Jail=Fail

x2.

 

[lotus blade]

bandgeek and i have a same concept. i dont give ST's and Freedays for 1 reason: THEY....GET...ME...KILLED! now, the objective of the jailers is to get to the last terrorist so he can have a last request. i am not disagreeing with your point Phase, but i will do everything in my power to keep the prisoners from jeprodizing my plans to getting to an LR. if that means killing off people who move, then thats what ill do. i will be a little more leniant with this said, but dont think your gonna move and not get punished for it. because you just gave me an idea for these people who move. so the bottom line is, try to settle down on the trigger finger and more leniancy is needed.

 

[Euphoric]

I don't play jail because of the reasons above, too much freekilling and all this other good stuff.

 

[PhaseXero]

Hmmm, I somewhat agree with what you have said. I think a good proportion of the time you should be aiming to get to LR as much as possible. However I think a hallmark of a good warden is the ability to allow as many terrorists to have as much fun as it is possible. This includes letting people go for disobeying trivial orders, even such as moving if in the overall grand scheme of things it means nothing.

Does this mean you die more often? Yes. There is almost a ridiculous fear of death on jail. On certain maps, yes it's almost impossible to get away with not doing trivia. I do have some solutions rather than just pointing out what's wrong.

1. Gun checks as often and as frequent as possible
2. Wardening is about controling the CTs as much as it is the Ts. Wrong area? Let them know.
3. People disobeying when "no gunplanting" has been called should be punished more severely. I think this point is especially important as this can really ruin a round.
4. Refer to other threads for fun stuff to do with Ts as a warden

 

[iamevilbear]

I want to run something by everyone. Just because you are in the clan does not mean the rules of jail do not apply to you.

I'm seeing far too many CTs planting weapons before cells even open. I also see people planting primary weapons. Well guess what, just because you are in the clan doesn't mean you get a free pass from admins. Read the jail rules, that is not allowed. You may be revoked or escorted out of the server entirely.

As for ST.. Giving ST to the same member does not help us attract pubs to come play. When you give e or eG or eGO anybody ST every round what do you think that says about our clan. It says that we are playing favorites.

Listen to Phase. He knows what he is talking about. He has been around far longer in Jail than I have. If I can identify these issues, then everyone can. Try and think of the public players and include them in your activities so that we don't end up with frustrated players that end up swearing or freekilling.

If we can all try and have fun in there people will be more willing to come back and play with us.

As for what us admins can do differently to help you enjoy your stay.. We are working on what is and isnt proper revoke times. I personally think revoking over 3 rounds is criminal. With rounds that last 6-7 minutes at a time, revoking them for even this much time can really affect the way they feel about the server.

Either way, some things need to change. Hopefully you guys can work together with us.

Ryan

 

[Angeal]

Well like i said, I used to like playing Jail But ever since we do Trivia the whole time I've stopped playing there.

As a warden, You've got to keep them right where you want them...

Try to be nice, You know have a freeday one round, Then go to a normal day and hope

that one person doesn't kill you, Because if they do kill that one person then they shot

their self in the foot, And they next warden isn't going to be the same...

The only one who can change this is you, And without that they have nothing.

 

[Chase]

Theres a reason you dont see me on there anymore...
The point of no return has been passed my friends.

 

[Enforce]

Doesn't matter how many threads of these you make, people won't change. Get over it. Unless they are willing to stop, they never will.

This is why I don't play jail anymore.

 

[PeZku]

There is no more trivia day.

It's always a trivia week. Then a zombi freeday. Then a trivia week again.

I play Jail only to rebel anyway. CTs really like to give me deagles. And I like to shoot wardens with them. Teehee.

But yeah, a good day of Jail is a rare thing these days, but when there are very good CTs and the Terrorists wont whine about that one freekill that happened 5 rounds ago... That is like heaven.

Remember, I can still smell you fear CTs...

 

[PhaseXero]

Doesn't matter how many threads of these you make, people won't change. Get over it. Unless they are willing to stop, they never will.

That's a defeatist attitude. If we all think jail can't change then nothing will ever happen. People need to step out and call out wardens, call them out for being for running the jail poorly.

If we see a problem, one that is fixable we should definitely try our best to stop the behaviour. The other threads simply gave problems, we need solutions. I think that we will have to do some rule changes to address this issue. I wish we didn't have to do this, but we need some hard and fast guide liness.

Possible Solutions

1. Limit the amount of people who can be killed by games which they have little control over. This is mainly games of chance and trivia. We have a 75% rule but why not limit the total amount which can be killed off.

2. Warden classes? We have classes for admins, why not jail classes. We can cover playing Ts and CTs as well as effective wardening?

Help me out guys! We know the problems, now we need people who care about jail to start giving us ways to fix it.

 

[Legend]

Possible Solutions

1. Limit the amount of people who can be killed by games which they have little control over. This is mainly games of chance and trivia. We have a 75% rule but why not limit the total amount which can be killed off.

2. Warden classes? We have classes for admins, why not jail classes. We can cover playing Ts and CTs as well as effective wardening?

Help me out guys! We know the problems, now we need people who care about jail to start giving us ways to fix it.

Is this honestly needed? You guys are playing a "fun" role playing game. You want the server to be less strict, but by implementing your ideas, isn't it making the jail server even more strict?

We shouldn't have to change the rules, we shouldn't have to have classes. It comes down to the people who play in the server, and how they want to play the game.

If you want to change on how the game plays, move on CT and be warden. Suggest to your friends that they play the same way, and maybe you will start a trend.

 

[PhaseXero]

That's the irony isn't it? That we need more rules to be less strict. Unfortunately we need to change things from a legislation perspective otherwise things will remain the status quo.

People won't change unless forced to. There is no trend, people have been trying to change things inside the game and failing for way too long. Being forced to let everyone wardens has its ups and downs.

As much as I hate to say it but this is what jail has come down to. It's not a fun role playing game anymore, it's serious business.