the new MMORPG by bioware called Star wars the old republic is coming out sometimes this year, prob at the end.. personally i think bioware makes the best games, like KOTOR and mass effect and that this MMO is going to be epic.. any one else have any info or would like to share comments about it?
star wars..
- Thread starter Grimm911
- Start date
- Joined
- May 18, 2009
- Messages
- 54
Lots of potential, if they ruin, well, I will be speechless. Looks absolutely fantastic so far
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/star-wars-mmo-mmorpg,9627.html
I was looking forward to playing SWMMO this year, too
I was looking forward to playing SWMMO this year, too
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/star-wars-mmo-mmorpg,9627.html
I was looking forward to playing SWMMO this year, too
that's fine. I want this game to rock, so they can take all the time they want....but not to long.
- Joined
- Mar 21, 2009
- Messages
- 434
The game shows a lot of promise but many concerns as well.
For additional reference, here's a recent article from MMORPG as well: http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/...lic-Some-Concerns-about-The-Old-Republic.html
Bioware is known for story quality and great character development.
Having great story content is never bad...unless that is all you have, which in an MMOG is more considered a flaw than a strength.
MMOGs require a degree of player freedom that unshackles them from the linear path of story progression. Players like to do things their own way and on their terms.
Having an epic story is all well and good, but if there is no room for them to explore their world and discover things to do for themselves then it ends up feeling restrictive; as if there's an enormous galaxy out worth exploring but all you get is what's inside this tiny box.
Just look at Star Trek Online for a great example on how things could possibly go wrong.
One thing I'm really worried about w/ Bioware is the way they do pathing in their games.
For SPRPGs like Dragon Age, KoToR, and Mass Effect, their pathing is very narrowed where you can take Path A (which goes to the left), Path B (which goes straight up the middle), or Path C (which goes off to the right).
Now each of these paths go in a different direction, but you can be sure that they will most likely end up at the same destination or intersect with another one of the paths that do.
This is effective for a single-player RPG, but it is horrible for an MMOG.
Once again, SWG is a prime example of this with the planet Kashyyyk. Instead of the wide open worlds created with Big World engine tech, they narrowed it into small navigated paths that snaked around like a large maze and ultimately pointed you to specific instances that lead to yet more mazes, more instances, and ultimately a dungeon or two.
Like I stated before, players like to exercise their player freedom. Restrictive pathing like this really jeopardizes the amount of space to work with in terms of planning future content. Having too much open space with nothing in it is much better than having little to no space to work with when you get around to planning and want to implement new additions to the game. You don't want to have to resort to instancing too much because everything ends up feeling extremely detached.
Wow is a perfect example of this. The only time you see loading screens is when you are either, A) logging into the game, B) traveling to a different continent, C) going into an instanced dungeon or battleground, or D) Rezzing after dying or getting ganked. Other than these few conditions, you are wandering around in a world that is completely connected and beautifully streamlined to give you exactly that feel and it wins on so many levels.
Personally, I would've thought Bioware would've seen how the lack of space in the first sixteen months of SWG's existence really angered the community and that they would consider that to be a major necessity.
Sure they can always add it in later, but again, it is such a huge part of Star Wars that, even though I witnessed it in SWG in '03 and most of '04, it seems almost inconceivable to play in the SW universe and not be able to get in a ship and fly around.
The lack of a third faction and faction-exclusive classes, which is also brought up in the article linked above, are concerns as well.
Bounty Hunters are Sith only? Smuggler, Republic only?
Now I understand that Han Solo, the most iconic smuggler of all time chose to help the Rebellion. But before that, he fought for the most important faction a smuggler knows...his own. Oh and then there was the small thing w/ the Hutt crime lord's faction, but that's thrown by the waysi...wait, no it's not.
The Hutt faction, though more in the shadows of the movies until Episode VI, was strong enough that neither faction, Rebellion or Empire, would take it on directly.
In the Old Republic days, they were even known to possess an empire of their own. Though they did eventually fall from empire to just powerful crime syndicate status, they were never so weak that they disappeared from sight.
So why do they always fail to be graced with their own neutral faction; especially when they employed Bounty Hunters and Smugglers probably moreso than the Republic and Sith combined?!
Why? Because if you take these two away from the Republic and Sith, those two factions, which are pretty much already dominated by a majority of force-user classes then look even more shallow than they already are.
Also I am still really concerned about Bioware and their holding to already established storylines. This is right from their website
From Bioware's Official TOR Website:
"Determined to dominate the galaxy
The true origins of the Sith remain shrouded in mystery. The Sith race was, in fact, largely unimportant until three thousand years ago, when Dark Jedi exiles arrived on Korriban and subjugated the Sith beneath their rule and their philosophy.
As the years passed, the Dark Jedi intermarried with those they ruled, and within generations, the word ?Sith? took on new meaning. This powerful new civilization began expanding rapidly, led by a growing population of ambitious dark Force-users. Fifteen hundred years ago, the Sith civilization?s boundaries reached the Republic, and the Great Hyperspace War began.
Dark Lord of the Sith Naga Sadow led his armies in an aggressive campaign to destroy the Galactic Republic. Though the Sith were successful at first, the Jedi Order rallied back to defeat their dark counterparts, systematically destroying the Sith civilization on Korriban.
Unbeknownst to the Jedi however, the last Emperor of the Sith managed to escape the carnage and fled into Deep Space with his most trusted Dark Lords.
These surviving Sith began rebuilding their society on a distant planet, hoping to one-day return for revenge.
Over the course of the next thousand years, the Sith Empire recovered its strength. The Emperor developed a massive Imperial military, a fleet of advanced warships, and undertook dark rituals which prolonged his life and his undisputed rule."
Now I had brought this up before in the TOR forums back when it was still brand new and it was assumed then that it was not Naga Sadow who escaped to the Unknown Regions to rebuild the Empire since he hid himself on Yavin 4, putting himself into suspended animation until Freedon Nadd wakes him up 600 years later and is killed by him. Instead we all assumed that it was really meant that one of his generals or lords escaped the Republic's grasp.
But the way this is worded still makes me uneasy because it easily sounds as though they are painting Naga Sadow, since he WAS the last emperor of the Old Sith Empire, as having escaped to the Unknown Regions instead of Yavin 4 and that could devastate the timeline.
No Naga Sadow on Yavin means that no one teaches the Dark Side to freedon Nadd in 4400 BBY.
No Dark Lord Freedon Nadd means he probably doesn't get to Onderon where he ruled until being interred in his tomb on the moon Dxun.
No Dark Lord Freedon Nadd means Exar Kun never seeks out Nadd's tomb on Dxun where he would've met Nadd's spirit, travel to Korriban, fall to the Dark Side becoming the Dark Lord of the Sith and begin the Great Sith War around 4000 BBY.
He in turn then never teams up w/ the Ketos of Koros Major to begin the Krath Holy Crusade.
Without the Great Sith war/Krath Holy Crusade, the Mandalorians don't participate in the war which means Mandalore the Indomitable isn't killed. Mandalore the Ultimate then doesn't take over and begin the Mandalorian Wars, which means Revan and Malak don't go to fight which means they don't fall to the dark side.
Of course no Revan and Malak means no Jedi Civil War and that likely negates the Exile and the Sith Triumvirate from ever coming to be.
Either way, there are some thoughts about some of the concerns I have for the game.
Now all of this doesn't mean I hate the game or that I'm not going to play it since being a former 5 year veteran of SWG, I have seen Star Wars at rock bottom.
All in all, it's Star Wars and I'm going to play, but like you hear in every piece of SW media, "I got a bad feeling about this".
For additional reference, here's a recent article from MMORPG as well: http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/...lic-Some-Concerns-about-The-Old-Republic.html
Bioware is known for story quality and great character development.
Having great story content is never bad...unless that is all you have, which in an MMOG is more considered a flaw than a strength.
MMOGs require a degree of player freedom that unshackles them from the linear path of story progression. Players like to do things their own way and on their terms.
Having an epic story is all well and good, but if there is no room for them to explore their world and discover things to do for themselves then it ends up feeling restrictive; as if there's an enormous galaxy out worth exploring but all you get is what's inside this tiny box.
Just look at Star Trek Online for a great example on how things could possibly go wrong.
One thing I'm really worried about w/ Bioware is the way they do pathing in their games.
For SPRPGs like Dragon Age, KoToR, and Mass Effect, their pathing is very narrowed where you can take Path A (which goes to the left), Path B (which goes straight up the middle), or Path C (which goes off to the right).
Now each of these paths go in a different direction, but you can be sure that they will most likely end up at the same destination or intersect with another one of the paths that do.
This is effective for a single-player RPG, but it is horrible for an MMOG.
Once again, SWG is a prime example of this with the planet Kashyyyk. Instead of the wide open worlds created with Big World engine tech, they narrowed it into small navigated paths that snaked around like a large maze and ultimately pointed you to specific instances that lead to yet more mazes, more instances, and ultimately a dungeon or two.
Like I stated before, players like to exercise their player freedom. Restrictive pathing like this really jeopardizes the amount of space to work with in terms of planning future content. Having too much open space with nothing in it is much better than having little to no space to work with when you get around to planning and want to implement new additions to the game. You don't want to have to resort to instancing too much because everything ends up feeling extremely detached.
Wow is a perfect example of this. The only time you see loading screens is when you are either, A) logging into the game, B) traveling to a different continent, C) going into an instanced dungeon or battleground, or D) Rezzing after dying or getting ganked. Other than these few conditions, you are wandering around in a world that is completely connected and beautifully streamlined to give you exactly that feel and it wins on so many levels.
Personally, I would've thought Bioware would've seen how the lack of space in the first sixteen months of SWG's existence really angered the community and that they would consider that to be a major necessity.
Sure they can always add it in later, but again, it is such a huge part of Star Wars that, even though I witnessed it in SWG in '03 and most of '04, it seems almost inconceivable to play in the SW universe and not be able to get in a ship and fly around.
The lack of a third faction and faction-exclusive classes, which is also brought up in the article linked above, are concerns as well.
Bounty Hunters are Sith only? Smuggler, Republic only?
Now I understand that Han Solo, the most iconic smuggler of all time chose to help the Rebellion. But before that, he fought for the most important faction a smuggler knows...his own. Oh and then there was the small thing w/ the Hutt crime lord's faction, but that's thrown by the waysi...wait, no it's not.
The Hutt faction, though more in the shadows of the movies until Episode VI, was strong enough that neither faction, Rebellion or Empire, would take it on directly.
In the Old Republic days, they were even known to possess an empire of their own. Though they did eventually fall from empire to just powerful crime syndicate status, they were never so weak that they disappeared from sight.
So why do they always fail to be graced with their own neutral faction; especially when they employed Bounty Hunters and Smugglers probably moreso than the Republic and Sith combined?!
Why? Because if you take these two away from the Republic and Sith, those two factions, which are pretty much already dominated by a majority of force-user classes then look even more shallow than they already are.
Also I am still really concerned about Bioware and their holding to already established storylines. This is right from their website
From Bioware's Official TOR Website:
"Determined to dominate the galaxy
The true origins of the Sith remain shrouded in mystery. The Sith race was, in fact, largely unimportant until three thousand years ago, when Dark Jedi exiles arrived on Korriban and subjugated the Sith beneath their rule and their philosophy.
As the years passed, the Dark Jedi intermarried with those they ruled, and within generations, the word ?Sith? took on new meaning. This powerful new civilization began expanding rapidly, led by a growing population of ambitious dark Force-users. Fifteen hundred years ago, the Sith civilization?s boundaries reached the Republic, and the Great Hyperspace War began.
Dark Lord of the Sith Naga Sadow led his armies in an aggressive campaign to destroy the Galactic Republic. Though the Sith were successful at first, the Jedi Order rallied back to defeat their dark counterparts, systematically destroying the Sith civilization on Korriban.
Unbeknownst to the Jedi however, the last Emperor of the Sith managed to escape the carnage and fled into Deep Space with his most trusted Dark Lords.
These surviving Sith began rebuilding their society on a distant planet, hoping to one-day return for revenge.
Over the course of the next thousand years, the Sith Empire recovered its strength. The Emperor developed a massive Imperial military, a fleet of advanced warships, and undertook dark rituals which prolonged his life and his undisputed rule."
Now I had brought this up before in the TOR forums back when it was still brand new and it was assumed then that it was not Naga Sadow who escaped to the Unknown Regions to rebuild the Empire since he hid himself on Yavin 4, putting himself into suspended animation until Freedon Nadd wakes him up 600 years later and is killed by him. Instead we all assumed that it was really meant that one of his generals or lords escaped the Republic's grasp.
But the way this is worded still makes me uneasy because it easily sounds as though they are painting Naga Sadow, since he WAS the last emperor of the Old Sith Empire, as having escaped to the Unknown Regions instead of Yavin 4 and that could devastate the timeline.
No Naga Sadow on Yavin means that no one teaches the Dark Side to freedon Nadd in 4400 BBY.
No Dark Lord Freedon Nadd means he probably doesn't get to Onderon where he ruled until being interred in his tomb on the moon Dxun.
No Dark Lord Freedon Nadd means Exar Kun never seeks out Nadd's tomb on Dxun where he would've met Nadd's spirit, travel to Korriban, fall to the Dark Side becoming the Dark Lord of the Sith and begin the Great Sith War around 4000 BBY.
He in turn then never teams up w/ the Ketos of Koros Major to begin the Krath Holy Crusade.
Without the Great Sith war/Krath Holy Crusade, the Mandalorians don't participate in the war which means Mandalore the Indomitable isn't killed. Mandalore the Ultimate then doesn't take over and begin the Mandalorian Wars, which means Revan and Malak don't go to fight which means they don't fall to the dark side.
Of course no Revan and Malak means no Jedi Civil War and that likely negates the Exile and the Sith Triumvirate from ever coming to be.
Either way, there are some thoughts about some of the concerns I have for the game.
Now all of this doesn't mean I hate the game or that I'm not going to play it since being a former 5 year veteran of SWG, I have seen Star Wars at rock bottom.
All in all, it's Star Wars and I'm going to play, but like you hear in every piece of SW media, "I got a bad feeling about this".
Galaxies was one of the best, until they ruined it with the everyoneisajedi patch.
