Vayne.

[Carmine]

I wasn't fed until I got 'ganked' and ended up killing 3 people by myself. She can run fast at the enemy player, and if she needs to get away, she can just roll back, shoot the enemy, then shoot him back, dealing a lot of damage.

But then again, good point, I was fed. But being fed with her is better than being fed with anyone else. Failboat or Sinx would tell me not to chase, even when I did, got the kill, and ran back, like it was nothing. I'm just saying something could be nerfed.. like her passive (Like getting 10 movement speed per 6 levels, starting at +20 movement speed)

I wouldn't say being fed with her is better than being fed with anyone else. You died twelve times. I will take a fed Corki over a fed Vayne 100% of the time, he puts out more damage, and he does it in an AoE.

I mean, obviously Riot didn't think she was very overpowered, all the nerfs she got were very tiny at most 10 damage nerfs. And that is the patch they are using for the dreamhack tournament, so if she was that overpowered you can be sure they would have made sure she was in line for the end of season 1 tourney.

 

[Jashadow]

My 12 deaths were from the fed Annie T-T
She is squishy, which is her downfall, but once I had my full build, and a banshee's veil, I could easily take on anyone. I'd choose Vayne over Corki, but I don't like Corki

 

[_MEGA]

Well my experience with Vayne is she is easy to take down in a 2 on 1 or even a one on one if you play correctly. Everyone has their special build that makes them "OP". Knowing how to play a champion doesn't make that champion OP. With Master Yi, I had a build that ended up with 300+ damage, 1.8 attack speed and like 2.4 when using my ultimate. I also had like a 55% crit and minor life steal.

 

[Jashadow]

Vayne is OP.

 

[Carmine]

Vayne is OP.

That's a pretty bold statement, care to back it up with any actual proof other than anecdotal evidence? Because I don't really see you doing that.

 

[PhsX]

No one has yet to prove to me that Vayne is OP. Not knowing how to deal with a new champion is not the same as that champion being overpowered, something it seems a lot of the community isn't aware of (See also: Nocturn).

 

[Jashadow]

That's a pretty bold statement, care to back it up with any actual proof other than anecdotal evidence? Because I don't really see you doing that.

It's my opinion. And it's not my own personal experience, it's what I've seen. From everyone. And okay Carmine. Every game I've played today I've gone up against a vayne. I will take snapshots and post them on here JUST for you. Well. Tomorrow. Don't really feel like playing LoL right now. Kind of feeling WoW..

No one has yet to prove to me that Vayne is OP. Not knowing how to deal with a new champion is not the same as that champion being overpowered, something it seems a lot of the community isn't aware of (See also: Nocturn).

Nocturne is OP.
Nah JK. But when he first came out, he was a little rediculous. You can say I'm wrong, but from what I've seen, you won't change my thoughts. Just the fact he could ult from really far and kill in 4 hits if you know how to play him.. Don't get me wrong, a lot of people didn't really know how to play him, but to the few that did, he was a little hard to deal with.

 

[Carmine]

It's my opinion. And it's not my own personal experience, it's what I've seen. From everyone. And okay Carmine. Every game I've played today I've gone up against a vayne. I will take snapshots and post them on here JUST for you. Well. Tomorrow. Don't really feel like playing LoL right now. Kind of feeling WoW..

What you've SEEN is anecdotal evidence. It has no point. I've SEEN plenty of people do incredible with Jax, and I've seen plenty of people fail miserably as Alistar. Does that make Jax any less crap and Alistar any less godlike? No, it doesn't.

Explain why Vayne is overpowered using math taking into account her skills, her ability in teamfights where there is more than one person to be targeted, etc. vs another carry, for this you might as well use Corki, when using the exact same items, lets say, just a Trinity Force. Then I might believe you.

 

[Enforce]

In my opnion, I think vayne is one of the strongest carries, not to say shes the strongest of them all, because, "imo" again, with the recent patch, corki took back his number wan spot with his famous delayed free flash that breaks ultimates like warwick's and amazing aoe damage.

What makes vayne strong is that true damage, the third silver bolt and the tumble combined, especially if it crits. She still hits like a rock, but not like a boulder with that 10 extra damage, haha.

"In the hands of a good player, [any champion] can be overpowered".

 

[Jashadow]

In my opnion, I think vayne is one of the strongest carries, not to say shes the strongest of them all, because, "imo" again, with the recent patch, corki took back his number wan spot with his famous delayed free flash that breaks ultimates like warwick's and amazing aoe damage.

What makes vayne strong is that true damage, the third silver bolt and the tumble combined, especially if it crits. She still hits like a rock, but not like a boulder with that 10 extra damage, haha.

"In the hands of a good player, [any champion] can be overpowered".

90% of all vaynes I see can get themselves fed and therefore BE overpowered. That's all I'm saying. Is she OP? I still think she is; her ability for true damage is just ludicrous. My opinion on her is like my opinion on Irelia, and her true damage ended up getting nerfed. Of course, I think 30% of the new champions that come out are just overpowered as it is, but this is my opinion. I'm tell you what I think, because I want to state my opinion, because I believe it is correct. You can disagree with it, and I respect that.

/done

 

[Enforce]

90% of all vaynes I see can get themselves fed and therefore BE overpowered. That's all I'm saying. Is she OP? I still think she is; her ability for true damage is just ludicrous. My opinion on her is like my opinion on Irelia, and her true damage ended up getting nerfed. Of course, I think 30% of the new champions that come out are just overpowered as it is, but this is my opinion. I'm tell you what I think, because I want to state my opinion, because I believe it is correct. You can disagree with it, and I respect that.

/done

I can't disagree with what you believe, because its what you believe, I can't contradict it. This is what I think:

In my opinion, for a champion to be overpowered, the champion must be able to output large amounts of damage even under countered conditions.

An example of a counterable champion would be Annie. Few months ago she was considered one of the strongest casters, but there exists champions such as Kassadin to shut down said champions. So is annie overpowered? no, because there are champions to counter her, she only fits her role as a mage.

Now a special case is Irelia. She was truly the FoTM, for one reason: 3 types of damage, a reduction of cc from her passive, and her tanky-ness per lvl. Her Q was the gap closer, the W was the truedamage/lifesteal and the E was the cc. She excels in her category Of course she needed a nerf, there was barely any counter to irelia, she was a pubstomper. She gets in your face. You can't really say anything about Irelia because she does her job very well, to focus the carry, her main role. Now Pre-nerf and Post-buff Irelia OP? I can agree with you there.

Now, compare Vayne to Irelia. True damage check, mobility check, 1 cc check, 1 escape check and no tanky ness. However she can be cc'ed. So what makes her excel in her category? The damage. Which got slightly touched to jump down to the same level as other carries. But, Vayne can be focused down just like Ashe and Corki, so in the big picture, she's just another carry. Can she 1v5? no, thats not her role.

What I'm trying to say is this, champions can't be considered overpowered, because they all have their roles to fit.

TL;DR: You gotta consider cs, gold, level, and team role to classify a champion as OP

 

[DuckDastardly]

I don't think she is OP, never thought she was. She was a strong champ and I believe the adjustments made helped bring her to the proper level.

I think the problem here is that people play way to aggressive against certain champs that once those champs snowball they become hard to stop. When I lane against those type of champs I play defensive, and poke them a little here and there. Get them to over commit and them put a little burst on them. If that doesn't force them to go back, then poke a bit more. Get them out of lane for a bit where they aren't getting XP and gold and they get behind. Oh, and MOST important try not to die to them by playing safe. If they can't get those kills they can't build items very fast. Too many people chase and die and that starts the snowball effect.

Of course that's my style of play, but I am just an average player that has found something that works for me.

 

[Aneruen]

I think you guys are setting the burden of proof a little too high for this forum.

 

[Carmine]

I think you guys are setting the burden of proof a little too high for this forum.

We will never see any intelligent discussions in this forum with that kind of thinking.

The thread would just be:

Vayne is op because in my experience she almost always does well.

No she isn't, I've seen the opposite thing happen.

That's your opinion.

Yep.

Okay.



No one learns anything, no one comes away from the discussion any smarter. It was pointless.

 

[Enforce]

No one learns anything, no one comes away from the discussion any smarter. It was pointless.