Building a new computer

[Asuryan]

I will post some pictures you don't need to worry haha and I'm just gonna take the 750 watt one I already had in mind the only difference is it's a silver certified instead of gold. Oh and would one of you guys mind helping me build it I haven't done it in awhile and what if any security system should I get like norton or what? Another thing huckleberry should I just stick with the ssd I already want or change it?

 

[reflex99]

You shouldn't get the 6970, get a 6950 and unlock it, save yourself the 100 dollars. Sound card is pointless, and your psu is ridiculous. Why get a modular psu when you're going to end up using everything anyway? Get the TX series instead, I use it, it's amazing.

On a side note, when getting an AMD gfx card always try getting the reference models, they are always nicer looking and the most stable. And get the SSD over the HDD, but get the corsair force 3 ones, they're cheaper and 120gig's for your os and a couple games is overkill lol

I wouldn't bank on unlocking. Especially now that new rev1 reference cards are completely non-existent.

Ok so I should change the following things
Get a 6950 instead of the 6970 and unlock it
Downgrade my psu to 750 maybe 650
And get the Ssd instead of the hd
Oh and I'm not going to put a couple games those were just the games of the higher performance side that I put on

i'd take it down to 500-600w unless you plan to get a second 6970 very soon.

Most people that say they are going to add a second card, never do. Probably because by the time they get around to it, the next generation is out already.

What are the power requirements of next generation cards? The point of a quality psu is to last. I would rather pay $10 more for a power supply that will have enough to meet my needs later down the road. If not, when you upgrade, you can also factor in another $150 to upgrade your psu. If you want a cheaper one, go for the 850w hcp antec. At 750w, the seasonic x750 is decently priced. Depending on when you buy though, prices mean little right now. There will always be various deals on different parts.

Sounds cards can make a world of difference, even on cheap speakers or headphones. So while you want to save him money and all, if he has needs for a sound card or just wants good audio with his equipment, get one. Though again, depending on your needs, a xonar dx, dg, or ds might suffice.

7950 TDP is 210w. Power consumption is more than likely going down for here on. 28nm is nice and chilly.

There are such things as quality mid-wattage power supplies. I would rather spend the extra $50 on a better graphics card than 250 unnecessary watts.

I will post some pictures you don't need to worry haha and I'm just gonna take the 750 watt one I already had in mind the only difference is it's a silver certified instead of gold. Oh and would one of you guys mind helping me build it I haven't done it in awhile and what if any security system should I get like norton or what? Another thing huckleberry should I just stick with the ssd I already want or change it?

I like Avast anti virus...

mostly because it is free.

 

[Cloakedsphere]

Microsoft security essentials. You should be 100% fine useing that.

 

[RustyPwns!]

I wouldn't bank on unlocking. Especially now that new rev1 reference cards are completely non-existent.



i'd take it down to 500-600w unless you plan to get a second 6970 very soon.

Most people that say they are going to add a second card, never do. Probably because by the time they get around to it, the next generation is out already.




7950 TDP is 210w. Power consumption is more than likely going down for here on. 28nm is nice and chilly.

There are such things as quality mid-wattage power supplies. I would rather spend the extra $50 on a better graphics card than 250 unnecessary watts.



I like Avast anti virus...

mostly because it is free.

What do you mean by non-existant? Where have you been dude?

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1387558&CatId=7005

You'd rather spend an extra 100 dollars for the same video card? That defeats the purpose of getting a crap psu just to save a couple bucks, why bottleneck a 1000 dollar computer with a 40 dollar psu? Buy a strong PSU to last a long time to let it be easier to upgrade in the future. So what if you add a video card? Replace the PSU with another one? To blow even more money? You have odd ways of thinking dude.

 

[phalanx]

Lets keep this civil and not start a flame war please.

 

[reflex99]

What do you mean by non-existant? Where have you been dude?

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1387558&CatId=7005

diamond doesn't change model number with card revisions.

google it, but current cards are this type despite being advertised as reference:

or the other kind with larger heatpipes and dual fans.

If you don't believe me, feel free to order it, but prepare to be disappointed.

You'd rather spend an extra 100 dollars for the same video card? That defeats the purpose of getting a crap psu just to save a couple bucks, why bottleneck a 1000 dollar computer with a 40 dollar psu? Buy a strong PSU to last a long time to let it be easier to upgrade in the future. So what if you add a video card? Replace the PSU with another one? To blow even more money? You have odd ways of thinking dude.

I never said same video card tyvm. I also never said $100. I said $50, and yes I would do that. $150 (corsair AX750 or whatever) - $50 = $100 = many excellend 500-650w power supplies.

Sorry, but you don't need to spend nearly that much to get a quality power supply. 650w will last you forever. There is never going to be a single GPU/CPU setup that cannot be run with a 650w power supply during the useful life of such power supply.

with $50 over $390, you would have $440 which could net you a nice GTX 580. A graphics card I would rather have over 100-250 useless watts.

 

[Cloakedsphere]

Rusty chillax man. But anyways. Just get a 6950. Your fine right now. I think these guys are just fighting to be fighting. plus it doesnt really matter which card you go with. You can pick one.

 

[Lightningcount]

Three problems so far.

First, your memory is 1600, it needs to be 1333. The only way it will run ddr3 1600 is with an overclock.

Second. You chose an overpriced, underpowered SSD.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227729

Compare the write/read times on your SSD to this one and then check the capacity and the price.

Thrid, this one really isnt a problem, just a preference. You are severely limiting yourself power for price wise when you chose an intel build. For about 30 bucks more, you can get a HEX core AMD with a MUCH better Mobo. On average intel mobos cost about 40-60 dollars more than AMD when compared with similar powered products.

Two options you could change, have better performance, and keep almost everrything else the same is the mobo and processor.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131736

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103913

Those two are good options. I use that motherboard and the 1090t amd processor. Not much difference in the two, but the 1090 is sold out right now.

 

[Asuryan]

Yeah I know I'm just gonna get the 6950 oh and what exactly do you want me to take pictures of like during the process or when it's fully complete?

 

[Asuryan]

@ lightningcount I kinda figured that out after doing some more research about memory and are you sure that ssd is better? They look practically the same with the same space just one is more expensive then the other. Another thing I am going to keep my computer a intel build because I've helped people and seen people with the 2500k and it's great in my opinion

 

[Lightningcount]

Compare the write and read speeds of the two SSDs. The OCZ is almost twice as fast.

 

[runo]

Three problems so far.

First, your memory is 1600, it needs to be 1333. The only way it will run ddr3 1600 is with an overclock.

I'm confused by this statement. Why can't he just install DDR3 1600 and be done with it?

Thrid, this one really isnt a problem, just a preference. You are severely limiting yourself power for price wise when you chose an intel build. For about 30 bucks more, you can get a HEX core AMD with a MUCH better Mobo. On average intel mobos cost about 40-60 dollars more than AMD when compared with similar powered products.

It isn't so much about the number of cores right now, IMO. I would take four very powerful cores with better caching, clock rates, voltage and overclockability than six cores with lesser caching, clock rates, voltage, and good overclockability.

He's already spending a lot on this build; the current generation of Intel CPUs and most of their motherboards are ahead of AMD's tech right now, even Bulldozer, and Ivy Bridge is coming relatively soon anyway. At his budget, his only limitation would be buying older technology, IMHO.

 

[iMatthew]

here's a cheaper gpu with close to the same specs. $120 cheaper

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161372&nm_mc=Criteo&cm_cat=Video+Cards&cm_pla=Hightech+Information+System+Ltd.&cm_ite=14161372&cm_ven=BAC-CriteoBrand

 

[reflex99]

Three problems so far.

First, your memory is 1600, it needs to be 1333. The only way it will run ddr3 1600 is with an overclock.

Second. You chose an overpriced, underpowered SSD.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227729

Compare the write/read times on your SSD to this one and then check the capacity and the price.

Thrid, this one really isnt a problem, just a preference. You are severely limiting yourself power for price wise when you chose an intel build. For about 30 bucks more, you can get a HEX core AMD with a MUCH better Mobo. On average intel mobos cost about 40-60 dollars more than AMD when compared with similar powered products.

Two options you could change, have better performance, and keep almost everrything else the same is the mobo and processor.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131736

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103913

Those two are good options. I use that motherboard and the 1090t amd processor. Not much difference in the two, but the 1090 is sold out right now.

I really don't think i have seen more misinformation in one post in a long time.

1. who cares if you have to overclock. This ain't no clarkdale, the SB IMC is good up to about 2400MHz, you are really ram limited at that point anyways. 1600MHz is out of spec, yes, but it will run.

If you buy 1600MHz ram, and the SB IMC will not hold 1600 CL9, I will personally buy you new 1333 mhz ram provided you can provide reasonable proof that the IMC is at fault.....

2. Marvell and Micron based drives like the 510, and M4 handle uncompressable data (movies, pictures, music) much better than sandforce drives, since SF-2xxx based drives rely on compression to bolster their performance numbers. Really it is a wash between the two when it comes to performance, but I would choose either the 320/510 or M4 over anything sandforce because of the firmware issues they are having this generation.

3. Maybe you are a bit behind on technology, but the i5 2500K outperforms all of the Thuban based AMD chips. Also 4.6GHz is almost garaunteed with the 2500K, while you are lucky to get 4GHz with a Thuban.

Yeah I know I'm just gonna get the 6950 oh and what exactly do you want me to take pictures of like during the process or when it's fully complete?

The process is always cool.

@ lightningcount I kinda figured that out after doing some more research about memory and are you sure that ssd is better? They look practically the same with the same space just one is more expensive then the other. Another thing I am going to keep my computer a intel build because I've helped people and seen people with the 2500k and it's great in my opinion

see above.

here's a cheaper gpu with close to the same specs. $120 cheaper

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161372&nm_mc=Criteo&cm_cat=Video+Cards&cm_pla=Hightech+Information+System+Ltd.&cm_ite=14161372&cm_ven=BAC-CriteoBrand

the 6970 lightning is "special"

yes, there are cheaper 6970s, but none that will overclock nearly as well or stay nearly as cool.

in reality though, the money is probably better spent else where though.

 

[Lightningcount]

I really don't think i have seen more misinformation in one post in a long time.

1. who cares if you have to overclock. This ain't no clarkdale, the SB IMC is good up to about 2400MHz, you are really ram limited at that point anyways. 1600MHz is out of spec, yes, but it will run.

If you buy 1600MHz ram, and the SB IMC will not hold 1600 CL9, I will personally buy you new 1333 mhz ram provided you can provide reasonable proof that the IMC is at fault.....

2. Marvell and Micron based drives like the 510, and M4 handle uncompressable data (movies, pictures, music) much better than sandforce drives, since SF-2xxx based drives rely on compression to bolster their performance numbers. Really it is a wash between the two when it comes to performance, but I would choose either the 320/510 or M4 over anything sandforce because of the firmware issues they are having this generation.

3. Maybe you are a bit behind on technology, but the i5 2500K outperforms all of the Thuban based AMD chips. Also 4.6GHz is almost garaunteed with the 2500K, while you are lucky to get 4GHz with a Thuban.



The process is always cool.



see above.



the 6970 lightning is "special"

yes, there are cheaper 6970s, but none that will overclock nearly as well or stay nearly as cool.

in reality though, the money is probably better spent else where though.

LoL Now I remember why I stopped coming to this forum. Real world experience > toms hardware forum searching.

Yes the AMD is a bit outdated. But then again when it comes to computer parts, everything is outdated six months later. Doesnt matter though. You will still get great performance out of a reasonably priced part and it will still run well 3 years down the line when you sell your old computer on craigslist.

The OCZ line of SSDs are far superior to Intel when it comes to both raw numbers, and stability. Granted the new vertex line has some problems with windows 7... but I put my blame on microsoft for that one. The solid 3 lives up to its name. Its a solid piece of hardware that does what it says and will not let you down. You will just have to put your steam folder on another hard drive.

As for the ram. Why go through the trouble of overclocking, as minute as it may be, when you can just downgrade SLIGHTLY, emphasis on slightly, and get very similar performance. Idk if you have ever had a budget before. But a slight downgrade for better money and nearly same performance is a better deal than having to overclock and paying a little more.

 

[I'm your huckleberry]

LoL Now I remember why I stopped coming to this forum. Real world experience > toms hardware forum searching.

Yes the AMD is a bit outdated. But then again when it comes to computer parts, everything is outdated six months later. Doesnt matter though. You will still get great performance out of a reasonably priced part and it will still run well 3 years down the line when you sell your old computer on craigslist.

The OCZ line of SSDs are far superior to Intel when it comes to both raw numbers, and stability. Granted the new vertex line has some problems with windows 7... but I put my blame on microsoft for that one. The solid 3 lives up to its name. Its a solid piece of hardware that does what it says and will not let you down. You will just have to put your steam folder on another hard drive.

As for the ram. Why go through the trouble of overclocking, as minute as it may be, when you can just downgrade SLIGHTLY, emphasis on slightly, and get very similar performance. Idk if you have ever had a budget before. But a slight downgrade for better money and nearly same performance is a better deal than having to overclock and paying a little more.

Sequential read and write are pretty much useless. Intel and crucial are more reliable and the way to go.

1600 ram is a no brainer. It is a quick change in the bios to allow for the correct speed. At $30, it is as cheap if not cheaper at times than 1333 depending on the deal going on.

AMD is a terrible buy for top performance. Intel owns them. They basically came out and said they are quitting cause they can't compete.

 

[reflex99]

LoL Now I remember why I stopped coming to this forum. Real world experience > toms hardware forum searching.

Yes the AMD is a bit outdated. But then again when it comes to computer parts, everything is outdated six months later. Doesnt matter though. You will still get great performance out of a reasonably priced part and it will still run well 3 years down the line when you sell your old computer on craigslist.

The OCZ line of SSDs are far superior to Intel when it comes to both raw numbers, and stability. Granted the new vertex line has some problems with windows 7... but I put my blame on microsoft for that one. The solid 3 lives up to its name. Its a solid piece of hardware that does what it says and will not let you down. You will just have to put your steam folder on another hard drive.

As for the ram. Why go through the trouble of overclocking, as minute as it may be, when you can just downgrade SLIGHTLY, emphasis on slightly, and get very similar performance. Idk if you have ever had a budget before. But a slight downgrade for better money and nearly same performance is a better deal than having to overclock and paying a little more.

1. I would say the consensus of a mass is greater than individual experience. yes. Tom's however are a load of nuts.

2. why would you buy something that is already over a year old, and is slower than what a competitor is offering for a similar price? It just doesn't make sense. I personally will probably never buy an Intel desktop processor, but I do not hesitate to recommend them to others because I realize that they are superior at the current time.

3. There are tons of articles. I can link them if you want. OCZ (and other sandforce-based drive manufacturers, ex. corsair) has been having a tough time getting the firmware right on their newer sandforce drives. Now it is ok, but who knows if another issue will pop up, how long will it take them to fix it. Both Crucial and Intel have proven quick and effective at patching flaws in their products.

Again, The numbers with current sandforce drives are with highly compressible data. The second you hit something like a video, or music, your throughput will plummet. It is an effective strategy for many types of data, especially stuff that compresses well. The point I'm trying to make however, is that you can't judge an SSD based on numbers alone. Similar to how you can't judge a processor based on clock speed alone. A 3.8GHz pentium 4 will get the snot beat out of it by a 2.66GHz Core2Duo.

4. Overclocking ram on modern computers is not difficult at all. In-fact, most ram manufactured within the last 5 or so years will more than likely have an appropriate XMP profile in the SPD for it's rated spec. To literally all you have to do is select the speed you want in the bios/EFI

I don't understand why you think 1600MHz ram is a lot more money
For example, this 1600MHz CL9 ram is cheaper than the ram you posted a few pages ago:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231428
Perhaps you don't like red, and blue is more you thing. Luckilly Kingston makes a nice kit of 8GB 1600MHz ram for the same price as the ram you posted:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820104246

 

[pandA.]

My cousin is building me one for christmas About how much is a gaming computer when you build it? I want to play my cousin back.

 

[Lightningcount]

1. I would say the consensus of a mass is greater than individual experience. yes. Tom's however are a load of nuts.

2. why would you buy something that is already over a year old, and is slower than what a competitor is offering for a similar price? It just doesn't make sense. I personally will probably never buy an Intel desktop processor, but I do not hesitate to recommend them to others because I realize that they are superior at the current time.

3. There are tons of articles. I can link them if you want. OCZ (and other sandforce-based drive manufacturers, ex. corsair) has been having a tough time getting the firmware right on their newer sandforce drives. Now it is ok, but who knows if another issue will pop up, how long will it take them to fix it. Both Crucial and Intel have proven quick and effective at patching flaws in their products.

Again, The numbers with current sandforce drives are with highly compressible data. The second you hit something like a video, or music, your throughput will plummet. It is an effective strategy for many types of data, especially stuff that compresses well. The point I'm trying to make however, is that you can't judge an SSD based on numbers alone. Similar to how you can't judge a processor based on clock speed alone. A 3.8GHz pentium 4 will get the snot beat out of it by a 2.66GHz Core2Duo.

4. Overclocking ram on modern computers is not difficult at all. In-fact, most ram manufactured within the last 5 or so years will more than likely have an appropriate XMP profile in the SPD for it's rated spec. To literally all you have to do is select the speed you want in the bios/EFI

I don't understand why you think 1600MHz ram is a lot more money
For example, this 1600MHz CL9 ram is cheaper than the ram you posted a few pages ago:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231428
Perhaps you don't like red, and blue is more you thing. Luckilly Kingston makes a nice kit of 8GB 1600MHz ram for the same price as the ram you posted:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820104246

Hmm... You have me on the ram part. I have not shopped for ram in about 5 months so you are right there.

As for the CPU. I am not stating it will outperform the intel on benchmarks. But that it is a good/cheap alternative to the intel. Better for budget.

On the SSD. You... are right on that part. But that isnt what I was trying to say. I probably didnt explain it correctly. I was suggesting that he use it as an OS/GAME storage device because when it comes to SSD. You dont have enough space for music and movies. Plus... I dont think many people will care about the extra wait time on how long it takes a movie to start. But when it comes to running the OS and games, the OCZ beats the snot out of Intel.

And I know its slightly, extremely, hippocrital of me to link Toms hardware on this one. But... These numbers dont lie. The OCZ have a solid gain on intel for this one.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/best-price-ssd,3070-5.html

 

[reflex99]

0. The 2500K is $220, the 1100T is $200. Not much of a difference. If you feel like waiting around, you can sometimes snag one on sale from microcenter/NCIX or something for ~$180. I don't see any value in AMD for high end processors at the current time. Unless you are someone who can't leave something un-tweaked, and you buy an 8150 like me, the 2500K is a better choice.....


1. Learning how sandforce works, and why it has some troubles when writing heterogeneous/uncompressable files:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/2899/3

TLR; it has to "compress" to do what it does. In the process creating an extremely complicated controller, which, as we have seen is very difficult for OEMs to write firmware for. It also causes slowdowns when writing/reading heterogeneous files. It is a GREAT technology, and is very efficient.

2. I prefer to look at objective reviews, rather than subjective buying guides when doing my research. Buying guides are great if you are in a hurry, and want simple information quick, but if I want to know more about a product so i can make recommendations, i prefer reviews.

such as:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4253/the-crucial-m4-micron-c400-ssd-review/2
In non-sequential reads/writes, the M4 is up there with the Vertex 3, assuming you are using unoptimized data (which an OS is). I point out non-seqential, since you are suggesting it is a boot drive, and as such, will rarely see sequential reads or writes

3. The way I see it. The M4 is a tiny bit slower (marginal in most cases, and unnoticeable to anyone), but lacks the firmware issues that have plagued Sandfore SF-2xxx drives. For me, if it is going to hold my OS, I put reliability over speed (to an extent).

"beat the snot" is a total exaggeration. The Vertex 3, and M4 are within a margin that is unnoticeable to normal users.