Thoughtful Discussion: CSS Jail Server

[XxDoomxX]

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Hello CS Division

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It has come to my attention that lately our jail server has gone quite dead

Its gametracker rank at this time is over 2000 and its player count looks like a flatline

I would like to reach out to you, the players, and ask

Why is our jail server currently dying?

Why are you not playing jail?

and

What can be done to bring jail back?

It is the mission of myself and many other server fillers to preserve the servers we have. However at this rate, Jail is destined for a future decommissioning.

I for one, would not like to see the jail server removed. I am here in eGO because of it, and I spend 9 hours a night in it in an attempt to keep it from being empty.



And so we begin a thoughtful discussion on jail



Rules for thoughtful discussion

- No Whining

- Everyone get along to your best ability

- Discuss peoples ideas, do not burn on them

- If you have nothing to contribute do not post

- Give good ideas

- Provoke thought and discussion

- Somewhat detailed reasoning (no "jail sucks" or "make it 24/7 surf")​

 

[Terror]

What an amazing, thoughtful discussion!

My input: The transition to fill high school, bring its ranks up on the server listing, I believe, led to the emptying of Jail. And people were unhappy with the credit usage system or something like that, to my knowledge.

 

[Cheezyshooter]

1. No idea. I could state the obvious answer, but that wouldn't help at all.
2. To be honest, I got bored.

The following is my complete honest opinion.
If you don't want to see this "whining" just skip to number 3.

You all know I played jail like everyday, for hours, for a year, a while ago. Nowaday I just lack the patience that I use to have for it. Once you die, you have to wait sometimes 11 min just to get another round. I know it's been like that forever, but it really did become very slow pace (especially when the reason you died is because some idiot free kills you). Here's another thing, I'm not going to name people, but certain people became very annoying (especially on the mic) and that was also a big part of why I stopped.

3.What can be done? I have absolutely no idea sorry, but I do have faith that one day it will return to be as interesting as i was when I first started playing.

 

[kilroyy-]

Jail is boring imo. The only time I play is late at night with friends.

 

[BuffHamster]

1. No idea man!

2. The fun personalities are gone, makes it boring for me. I used to come for the people not the game itself.

3. No clue man.

 

[Maserati]

I dont like taking orders? I do like helping kids stay in [high] school though

On a serious note, the few times I did go on... it was a bit of a wait before you could even start playing.

 

[kirskenn]

2. The fun personalities are gone, makes it boring for me. I used to come for the people not the game itself.

I agree with this, but I don't really know why it's not as popular at all anymore.

For me I used to love jail but now I wouldn't play it due to people being annoying at everything they do

 

[RedDragonKnight]

1. Potentially because CTs/Wardens seem to play to lose. Most wardens seem to be overly strict to the point where the game isn't fun for the Ts while other wardens seem to be overly lax on orders(freedays as often as you can, orders that are really doomed to fail because you gave your team no time to react), to the point where it's not fun for the CTs. Combined with stale, repeated rounds, there isn't much fun to be had.

2. Sometimes it is because nobody else is ever on. When I am on, strict, repetitive, and uncaring (not necessarily all 3 at once) wardens siphon the fun that I have. Inb4 oh rdk you should be warden. I don't wish to be warden. Jail to me has always been a role playing game first and foremost; putting my feet into the boots of a pretend guard against the roughest prisoners ever to get caught. I don't see myself as much of a leader(I'll do it when necessary, but not because I want to), and that reflects on how I act in jail when I refuse to take warden.

3. When credits were introduced, I believe it caused a shift in jail's audience. Some were there just for credits so they could blow rounds away with overpowered awards. This wasn't jail to me, so I stopped playing as much as I had prior to credits being introduced. With credits removed, the audience hasn't really shifted back. I'm not sure how we can get it to shift back, but I've said it before and I'll say it again: No detours and No delays needs to go back to being implied. I doubt it would fix the problem altogether, but it would be a start. I still don't know why rogues newer maps were removed, but I enjoyed the different feel of jail that they gave back when bomb planting was enabled. Ive wanted to see that back since it was removed, but I still don't expect it to ever happen. and limit freedays when cts are losing. would fix one of the issues I have in number 2.

 

[Enfohip]

3. When credits were introduced, I believe it caused a shift in jail's audience. Some were there just for credits so they could blow rounds away with overpowered awards. This wasn't jail to me, so I stopped playing as much as I had prior to credits being introduced. With credits removed, the audience hasn't really shifted back. I'm not sure how we can get it to shift back, but I've said it before and I'll say it again: No detours and No delays needs to go back to being implied. I doubt it would fix the problem altogether, but it would be a start. I still don't know why rogues newer maps were removed, but I enjoyed the different feel of jail that they gave back when bomb planting was enabled. Ive wanted to see that back since it was removed, but I still don't expect it to ever happen. and limit freedays when cts are losing. would fix one of the issues I have in number 2.

this

and

the newer, non eGO-made maps are not as fun to me

also i have been playing a lot of CS:GO lately, and havent been getting onto CS:S as much

 

[a3yko]

I believe that most of the usual jail players moved on I don't know why but it does seem like they did

I think that jail would be a lot of fun when Christy finishes the new plugins or maybe he has and I haven't been paying attention but I think if we give Christy sometime to release the plugins and see if everyone likes it (knowing the little bit that I do about Christy I'm sure he's working on something worth waiting for) let's just be patient for a lil bit and see what happens

Another thing is I would like to agree with cheezy and rdk 90% of jail was cts with no mics and wardens who would get their team killed or bait their team for kills

 

[XxDoomxX]

1. Potentially because CTs/Wardens seem to play to lose. Most wardens seem to be overly strict to the point where the game isn't fun for the Ts while other wardens seem to be overly lax on orders(freedays as often as you can, orders that are really doomed to fail because you gave your team no time to react), to the point where it's not fun for the CTs. Combined with stale, repeated rounds, there isn't much fun to be had.

2. Sometimes it is because nobody else is ever on. When I am on, strict, repetitive, and uncaring (not necessarily all 3 at once) wardens siphon the fun that I have. Inb4 oh rdk you should be warden. I don't wish to be warden. Jail to me has always been a role playing game first and foremost; putting my feet into the boots of a pretend guard against the roughest prisoners ever to get caught. I don't see myself as much of a leader(I'll do it when necessary, but not because I want to), and that reflects on how I act in jail when I refuse to take warden.

3. When credits were introduced, I believe it caused a shift in jail's audience. Some were there just for credits so they could blow rounds away with overpowered awards. This wasn't jail to me, so I stopped playing as much as I had prior to credits being introduced. With credits removed, the audience hasn't really shifted back. I'm not sure how we can get it to shift back, but I've said it before and I'll say it again: No detours and No delays needs to go back to being implied. I doubt it would fix the problem altogether, but it would be a start. I still don't know why rogues newer maps were removed, but I enjoyed the different feel of jail that they gave back when bomb planting was enabled. Ive wanted to see that back since it was removed, but I still don't expect it to ever happen. and limit freedays when cts are losing. would fix one of the issues I have in number 2.

Maybe we should take a step back then and start fresh

Limit the number of maps we have on rotation (back to eGO only maps)

Add bombs to Rogues maps (it changed things up, kept it fresh)

Detours and delays implied (it gets repetitive to say that over and over)

Fast Download...which means getting rid of as much add ons as we can. No one wants to spend 10 minutes downloading for a near empty server...sorry to say

 

[Ryan]

I liked jail before there were these power ups and skins. Just like ole' times.

 

[Skooze]

I'll start out by saying I'm very new to this whole Jail server thing. I've been playing Counterstrike for a long time (10+ years) but took a hiatus the past 7 years or so. Coming back and seeing some of the same maps in CS:S was cool (cs_italy, cs_office). I love the idea of eGO which is why I joined. I tried playing Jail but obviously it is a different type of gameplay than a traditional CS:S game. As someone else mentioned, a RPG, not a FPS.

The few times I've played on Jail, it seemed very 'cliquey' to me. Like if you were new, nobody really helped you or explained what was going on. I didn't really get the credits stuff.

Anyway, I played last night after the CS:S event. There were a few people but I'm still grasping at 'what's the point'? of this map. I'm up for something new as the shoot-em-up traditional CS:S can get old (anything gets old after a while).

I can say the initial downloads of all the items,maps,add-ons is a bit annoying. I get it is custom, but it can take a while. I also get bored watching other people play for 10 minutes because I'm dead. I suppose that is the nature of the game.

HOpefully this was thoughtful. I mostly wanted to join in the discussion as I'm fairly new to eGO and have played jail a handful of times. Been trying to get my brain around it for a couple months.

I'm game to filling the server , though, and getting usage increased.

 

[MHeroFighter]

Why is our jail server currently dying?
Jail Rules Changing

Why are you not playing jail?
Playing CS:GO Competitive... But more fun with Leadership

What can be done to bring jail back?
Detours and Delays Implied
Delete the least played maps
Fix/Update Map (ba_darkness) Mainly for People who know Maze so we can Race

 

[Enfohip]

Maybe we should take a step back then and start fresh

Limit the number of maps we have on rotation (back to eGO only maps)

Add bombs to Rogues maps (it changed things up, kept it fresh)

Detours and delays implied (it gets repetitive to say that over and over)

Fast Download...which means getting rid of as much add ons as we can. No one wants to spend 10 minutes downloading for a near empty server...sorry to say

yes please!

 

[Ric]

We are not adding bombs to maps.

We took it off because so many people got upset that when someone planted the bomb, all Prisoners became wanted. I forgot what map it was, but the Warden would always order the Prisoners into pool at the beginning of the map, the Prisoners spawned with the bomb, so it was inevitable. Over, and over, and over, and over, and over, and over.

 

[Ric]

Why is our jail server currently dying?
Because it's the Holidays and Jail always goes empty around this year. Picks up in January/February. It's been like this since 2010. We've made some of the changes you requested, so surely that can't be it.

A lot of people are used to seeing the summer time numbers and panic during Holiday time. Relax, it'll be OK. Uncle Ric is here to comfort you.


Why are you not playing jail?
Why am I not playing anything is the real question.


What can be done to bring jail back?
Us getting our asses in Jail and filling it up.

 

[Gerbil]

I believe that most of the usual jail players moved on I don't know why but it does seem like they did

This. and

Why is our jail server currently dying?
Jail Rules Changing

this.

1. Pretty much what other people have already said, our pubs got frustrated and bored as did our admins.

2. I didn't really have the time for it, but I also just got bored of it, I'm trying not to whine, but it can be very frustrating trying to admin/keep the peace on jail especially when jail rules change constantly, I know rules had to change sometimes, but I felt there were a lot of inconsistencies between admins just because some people (myself included) were confused. Also what the cheeseball said about the rounds taking forever, aaaand a lot of our fun wardens were gone. *cough cough* SHANAYNAY, BUFF, CYANIDE. looking at you

3. People coming back to jail with fresh minds and eyes, and rebuilding a pub player base with the help of the CS server filling team

 

[Alfonse]

Why is our jail server currently dying?
The main reason is as Ric said: the jail server dies during the holidays. It's just the way it is. A large amount of our members are in grade school, high school or college. During the beginning of the year, everyone in school has sports and activities and they are learning new things, along with finals and the holiday stressors and blah blahdiddy blahdy blah. As soon as January or February hits, and the stresses of our <25 y.o. crowd start to wane, all of these people will start leaking back in, and then during the 3 or 4 weeks in which American schools let kids out for the summer, the servers will be flooded again. (Interesting note: I was recruited in February a year or two back due to the above reasoning.)

Why are you not playing jail?
Many, many reasons. As I'm sure some might know, I had logged quite a few hours in jail, playing it for at least an hour or two a day, sometimes up to 9 or 10 hours on weekends. However, once I got into the competitive CS:GO scene, I simply stopped playing CSS as I was having too much fun winning competitive matches. Skip ahead a couple months (a couple of months ago), and I re-entered jail and the Crackhouse server to see no familiar faces. No Crazyemo, no Gerbil, no AsianInvasion, no Population7 or StarRazor or Buffhamster or Cyanide. I never thought I'd be depressed to not see someone in a game that I had never met face to face before, but I truly missed the good times we had. This is part of the reason I'm not in Jail Servers anymore.

The other part of the reason is that I'm a senior in highschool. I'm so worried about grades and papers and college essays and scholarships (as well as financing a new gaming laptop to see me off to college and get me back in the scene) that I simply can't be bothered to play games right now. Maybe if I had some reason to convince me to play, I would, but with all of my prior friends spread or gone, nothing is pulling me back.

What can be done to bring jail back?
Obviously, when February hits, Jail will start having players again. However, despite what Ric said being true, there has been a noticeable decrease in Jail's numbers over time. I think that abolishing the credit system (is that still around?), reverting the rules, and being more lax will help everyone out. I know that I personally hated being an admin in Jail servers, and on crowded nights would even avoid it just so I didn't have to deal with all of the problems. I think that instead of having a giant book of convoluted rules, we should stick to very basic rules about freekilling and whatnot.

It's a simple set of correlations:
The admins are too strict on the guards ---> The guards don't have fun
The guards are too strict on the prisoners ---> The prisoners don't have fun
The well known fun jail players have no fun ---> The well known fun jail players leave
No well known fun jail players ---> Pubs have no fun
Pubs have no fun ---> Server empties

 

[Power]

I highly doubt jail will "come back" during after the holidays, even during the holiday season of previous years, the numbers were still good, not a flat line of 0 ... and if the server is at rank 2k + that means that it's been down for months now, not JUST the holiday season.

Why is our jail server currently dying? Points system ruined jail

Why are you not playing jail? Because it's always 0 people. Trust me, when I get on CSS first thing I look at is jail, if it has more than 5 people then I'm in.

What can be done to bring jail back? Completely agree with RDK, they made too many changes to jail, too bad my suggestion wasn't even considered. Remove !lr requests, keep it vanilla