Counter-Strike Delivered Auto revoke STs when Warden dies

[MS]

Hi all, currently on Jailbreak when the warden dies STs stay green. They must be manually revoked or be marked as a rebel when they damage a CT. According to the rules, STs are automatically revoked when the warden dies. To reduce confusion and to make the gameplay more accurately reflect the rules, I suggest STs be automatically removed (no marking, green is removed) when the warden dies.

 

[Damon]

I understand what you mean, but what happens if the Warden wants to let the STs keep their ST when the previous warden dies? He'd have to go through the entire process of reinstating each person that had ST. As it is now all Warden has to say is "ST is revoked", I feel like adding this would make the process more complicated then it really needs to be.

 

[4g0tt3nSou1]

Why should we take from STs who didn't inherently do anything wrong.
Also, STs still turn red on doing damage to a CT.
Of course it doesn't for other forms of rebelling like having a gun out or being close to stack, etc
There shouldn't be any confusion. STs shouldn't lose their ST just because someone in stack picked off the warden.

I see where your coming from.
To me this is a solution to a problem that doesn't exist.
It's on the warden to control the chaos, if they don't that's on them.
This if implemented would just piss off STs for no reason. What would be the point of trying for ST if the warden dies 5 second later?

Thanks for the suggestion all the same but that's a -1 from me.

 

[3dsam1]

Why should we take from STs who didn't inherently do anything wrong.
Also, STs still turn red on doing damage to a CT.
Of course it doesn't for other forms of rebelling like having a gun out or being close to stack, etc
There shouldn't be any confusion. STs shouldn't lose their ST just because someone in stack picked off the warden.

I see where your coming from.
To me this is a solution to a problem that doesn't exist.
It's on the warden to control the chaos, if they don't that's on them.
This if implemented would just piss off STs for no reason. What would be the point of trying for ST if the warden dies 5 second later?

Thanks for the suggestion all the same but that's a -1 from me.

This already is a rule. Hes simplying stating we should unmark STs. All STs are automatically revoked when the warden dies.
I think this would be a good thing to have and can cause less confusion

 

[MS]

I understand what you mean, but what happens if the Warden wants to let the STs keep their ST when the previous warden dies? He'd have to go through the entire process of reinstating each person that had ST. As it is now all Warden has to say is "ST is revoked", I feel like adding this would make the process more complicated then it really needs to be.

In practice on the server the warden only gives back STs when asked. I have never seen a warden state on their own that STs get to keep their own ST. Automatically removing the players' STs is merely a way to reinforce the understanding that they are no longer ST unless explicitly reissued it by the new warden. This change would be beneficial to Ts to avoid being killed for a misunderstanding and would be helpful to guards to prevent confusion and hesitation. Ideally there shouldn't be that many STs and I don't think it would be too difficult to re-issue the ST's their status.

Again by default according to the rules STs are revoked, so it doesn't make sense that they keep their green when the warden dies. The only argument I can think of is it is what contributes to the prison feeling, and it is up to the CTs (and the new warden) to get control back of the prisoners and thusly clarify the STs. However as the game currently is I think half the time that guards would kill a player that was marked as ST they would complain because they believed they actually had ST despite the rules saying otherwise. In other words I believe the confusion merely contributes to a server disruption rather than a game disruption.

 

[4g0tt3nSou1]

Given that the rules state that they do in fact lose ST on warden death I get a little bit more of what your coming from. I STILL disagree, but given the context of the rules; thus either needs added or the rule needs changed.
I retract my -1, +0.

Thanks for the suggestion.

 

[Crazy]

In the rules they do lose their ST, and because of that it also does question if new Wardens are even able to give them their ST because technically (in the strictest of senses) they are giving them ST for nothing unless they have contra of some sort. But then you would think that they would have to give it to everyone else with contra as well.
For that reason I think that there should be a rule clarification on if new wardens can actually give back ST when warden dies. Depending on that outcome, then I think this feature would be useful.

+/- Neutral

 

[MS]

In the rules they do lose their ST, and because of that it also does question if new Wardens are even able to give them their ST because technically (in the strictest of senses) they are giving them ST for nothing unless they have contra of some sort. But then you would think that they would have to give it to everyone else with contra as well.
For that reason I think that there should be a rule clarification on if new wardens can actually give back ST when warden dies. Depending on that outcome, then I think this feature would be useful.

+/- Neutral

This is actually an excellent point, according to the rules the Warden can only give ST for
contraband, blood-hounding (cannot blood-hound without reward), or by earning it in a game. So by this logic the Warden could only give players (back) ST if they have contraband; and by extension they would also have to give ST to all players that have contraband. So in other words, the Warden can't say "STs keep their ST" because the STs already lost their ST, and they would have to earn it back again.

I think this is a pretty conclusive reason to revoke STs. Damon

(Unless, of course, you add a rule saying Warden can allow marked STs to keep their ST when the warden dies).

 

[Jacko]

+1

If im not wrong the reason ST is revoked immediately after Warden dies is to prevent confusion with who actually had ST last round. T's would falsely claim they had ST and it would be a back and forth bullshit that would inevitably delay the round and create a toxic vibe to the server.

Wardens are not required to use the Warden menu so not all ST's are green. Removing all current green ST's whenever Warden dies would be good, as MS said, it would accurately reflect the rules.

Maybe we can add a feature that strips all ST's after Warden dies . Chat should then say i.e "Jacko's ST was automatically revoked!" to allow the new Warden to easily tell who had ST.

 

[4g0tt3nSou1]

Wardens are not required to use the Warden menu so not all ST's are green.

That's no longer the case, they are green regardless now and there isn't a warden menu anymore to my knowledge.

 

[sabo]

Wardens may want to keep the ST's as st in the middle of a situation where the warden can't go into warden menu because he/she is commanding t's as they are supposed to

I haven't seen it very hard to understand that sts are auto revoked on warden death unless stated otherwise either

+0

 

[MS]

That's no longer the case, they are green regardless now and there isn't a warden menu anymore to my knowledge.

Wait so the server automatically detects it a player gets ST? Damn that's pretty impressive! But how does it know? Are you listening to voice data and using machine learning to detect who's given ST? Or maybe you're offloading the workload and using a cloud based API... That must be pretty conplicated. I guess the system is so flawless cause either no one uses the system or the system makes it seem like it was the warden that gave the ST.

But wait does that mean the server can inject voices into my head? That actually makes a lot of sense, the server could force certain phrases that are generated based on the gameplay, maybe that could also mean that the players aren't real?? Wait so who's to say that I'm actually just playing the server only, and the servers just realllly good at making me think I'm not alone when I'm reality I'm being constantly monitored and watched.

Ok let's shelve the idea of the auto at revoke cause this apparent AI system is dope as hell. Can you also implement it so that the AI automatically muted mic spammers? I think that would be a nice feature that everyone would appreciate. On second thought maybe giving the AI powers and control over other players isn't the best idea... It might ban the owner after all ROFL xD lmaoff!!

No but seriously what do you mean by that isn't the case? Are you saying it's required that wardens make STs with /St? If so then that should probably be added in the rules. It also still enforces the idea that green = st. Ie warden dying but someone's green, they're still ST.

 

[4g0tt3nSou1]

Spoiler: reply

Wait so the server automatically detects it a player gets ST? Damn that's pretty impressive! But how does it know? Are you listening to voice data and using machine learning to detect who's given ST? Or maybe you're offloading the workload and using a cloud based API... That must be pretty conplicated. I guess the system is so flawless cause either no one uses the system or the system makes it seem like it was the warden that gave the ST.

But wait does that mean the server can inject voices into my head? That actually makes a lot of sense, the server could force certain phrases that are generated based on the gameplay, maybe that could also mean that the players aren't real?? Wait so who's to say that I'm actually just playing the server only, and the servers just realllly good at making me think I'm not alone when I'm reality I'm being constantly monitored and watched.

Ok let's shelve the idea of the auto at revoke cause this apparent AI system is dope as hell. Can you also implement it so that the AI automatically muted mic spammers? I think that would be a nice feature that everyone would appreciate. On second thought maybe giving the AI powers and control over other players isn't the best idea... It might ban the owner after all ROFL xD lmaoff!!

No but seriously what do you mean by that isn't the case? Are you saying it's required that wardens make STs with /St? If so then that should probably be added in the rules. It also still enforces the idea that green = st. Ie warden dying but someone's green, they're still ST.

Jacko had stated that ST's are not always given a green color denoting ST and there might be something that makes this not the default.
This isn't accurate. They still are green until they are revoked or they rebel weather the warden dies or not, like Jacko implied. It doesn't always denote they are still ST or ST at all, as it can be used for marking purposes or revoked on warden death like the rules state.

I'm not implying anything close to what you sarcastically stated. Merely don't want a change to be made on some inaccurate info. People read these comments and help use them to accurately convey their own opinions based on all the info, The more accurate the info is the better. I'm not innocent either; people corrected me, and in doing so better helped me understand the problem. Just trying to help the same way.

 

[MS]

I suppose from my perspective it just makes sense to automatically revoke ST visually when the warden dies because STs automatically lose STs when the warden dies... Like does that not make sense? Even if STs are given for marking purposes, chances are the guard's first goal won't be to keep the team's intact when all the T's are running around due to the warden dying. And, again, the rules never say you can give ST just for having ST before the warden died.

It's still commonplace for CTs and "STs" to expect for them to still be ST.

Think of it this way: what harm can this system do. Especially considering the current rules (which, again, do not permit re-issuing ST), how can this system be bad for the server?

Wardens may want to keep the ST's as st in the middle of a situation where the warden can't go into warden menu

What type of situation are you thinking of? Effectively all ST's aren't ST's at all, and the rules clearly state that you can't give ST just for having ST previously. Keep in mind this will only happen when the warden dies, as in it's a freeday for all the traitors that aren't actively rebelling.

 

[Goosesk]

I really don't feel like it makes sense for them to lose it because for example the warden says "get to the red marker" and the st doesn't know his st is gone so a ct near bye could just kill him because he doesn't know his st green color is gone it would force the warden to put st on again or have to revoke the st.

 

[WaSe]

Or, we could just like, change the rule that states that STs aren't automatically revoked when the warden dies, because:
1). It's not followed nor enforced by warden already
2). It gets people killed for petty reasons because 95% of the time, the ST is just roaming around when the warden dies, and just wants to continue to do that not rebel. So, when they want to continue to roam, they will get killed because, technically, they are supposed to follow the wardens commands now (99% of the time, just be afk frozen).
3). Bad JB

 

[sabo]

ez fix eliminate st so that t's can't give up rebelling for them potentially getting lr easier

 

[MS]

I really don't feel like it makes sense for them to lose it because for example the warden says "get to the red marker" and the st doesn't know his st is gone so a ct near bye could just kill him because he doesn't know his st green color is gone it would force the warden to put st on again or have to revoke the st.

An addition could be a message that tells the ST "Your ST was revoked because the warden has died", similar to what happens when they rebel. It's also up to the players to read the rules and understand how ST works, by default this is already the case.

Or, we could just like, change the rule that states that STs aren't automatically revoked when the warden dies, because:
1). It's not followed nor enforced by warden already
2). It gets people killed for petty reasons because 95% of the time, the ST is just roaming around when the warden dies, and just wants to continue to do that not rebel. So, when they want to continue to roam, they will get killed because, technically, they are supposed to follow the wardens commands now (99% of the time, just be afk frozen).
3). Bad JB

This would also be a good fix, I don't have a preference. I just want the rules to properly reflect ingame.

 

[sabo]

this thread got msws eg

 

[Goosesk]

this thread got msws eg

Trueeee lol